Adding Flavor To Your Tau Army

[minmaxticus]

Here's my the general composition of my current Tau force...

1.) Two Teams of Fire Warriors w/ Drones
2.) Flight of Gun Drones
3.) Kroot with Shaper and Hounds
4.) Hammerhead
5.) Devilfish
6.) Crisis Team (Either HQ and Bodyguards or Three Regular Suits)
7.) Shadowsun
8.) Stealth Team
9.) Broadside

My Crisis Suits generally run with Missile Pods/Plasma Rifles/Multitrackers/ Targetlocks/Shield Generators, my Fire Warriors use Pulse Rifles, the Devilfish with Drones, Hammerhead with Standard Railgun, etc. Problem is, I'm pretty dissatisfied with my Kroot and sort of turned off by the lack of alien diversity in the standard Tau Empire models.

Granted, I bought my stuff up BEFORE the new codex's release in the last few years. So, I've been thinking of things I could do... my buddy Munkierevolution pointed out tonight after a huge painting session with lynxrpken and Seath_Tt that I could always run auxiliaries. And I like that idea of doing that... and throwing in some Tau flavor to a small Imperial Guard list army. Problem is, that can be an expensive expansion to undertake to get the HQ, the troops, etc. The main thing he was trying to sell me on was the awesomeness of having Ogrun fighting for the Tau. Then it occurred to me that I could... could play a Ogrun stated unit as another Tau alien force, but just not call them "Ogrun". And that'd be cool for the alien-ness and in friendly games, but it's probably not going to fly with most folks. So I started thinking about the neat stuff I could add to my army, and here's my short list:

1.) Skyray Missile Defense Ship
Reason: I like the idea of a roving artillery platform with seeker missiles that can be called in via Markerlights, and then having air support in later turns with the vehicle's burst cannons or smart missles.

2.) Vespid
Reason: I need aliens! But no, really... they're gun seems pretty neat and their fleet ability would be super helpful in mobility, etc. I also dig the model the more I look at 'em.

3.) Pathfinders?
Reason: I dunno, they seem useful...

4.) Ethereal
Reason: Seems like a good, cheap leader that I can throw into the army if I can't use shadowsun.

Other ideas I had:
Experiment with different weapons, like more Fusion Blasters. I find myself dealing with armor frequently in Seath's Eldar/Sisters of Battle and Lynx's Guard, and Munkie's starting up an Imp army himself... and I think he's got genestealers floating around too. I also like the idea of having stronger firepower, since I've been stuck with Firewarrior weapons doing no damage too often. I'm not happy with my Kroot, as I've said before... the idea of the auxiliaries is appealing because of the great flexibility of the Imp list, but it'd require mooching off my friends or dropping lots of money... It sucks that GW hasn't put out more Tau alien races, although having the Vespid IS a nice addition. But man oh man, what I'd give to have an "Ork Cannon" to launch speed bumps in front of my fire warriors...

[Sir_Servo]

Hmm that is quite a quandry you got yourself into there my friend. here are a few suggestions from my point of view.

1) look at a few other armies, necrons, orks, space marines. all of their troops are pretty much the exact same. Ohh sure orks get different weapons within thier squads, but they are still orks. Space marines have Scouts... but ohh wait, those are just SM with crappy armour saves (they even took a way the mohawks from 2nd). So you could look at the fact that you have a varitey in your troops choices.

2)I personally love path finders. Granted I got rid of my Tau before the new dex came out, but still from what I have read they just got better because of the improved Markerlights. Any who, the fact that these guys are fast, have markerlights and can have that great sniper rifle. Yes I like it, str 6 with a great AP and it pins! What is not to love? means that not only can these guys let your other units strike with better effiency, but they are also great for disrupting enemy lines.

3) Even in Tournaments if you have a squad that represent Ogryns, but isn't the correct model 99/100 times you will be allowed to use them as long as they are GW models. I have run into the same guy on a few different ocasions that uses old Squat Models as Imperial Guard and know one gives a damn. As long as you tell your opponent what is what and you stick by what you tell them they will be cool with it.

Hope this helps,
Servo

[minmaxticus]

Thanks for the thoughts.

With reference to the Tau specifically, part of the reason I was hoping for "more aliens" is that the flavor of the Tau is that they're a young but sprawling (?) coalition of alien races who are united under the guidance of the Tau Empire. They make it sound like the Kroot are just one of many, many other "races" who are a part of the Tau forces. The Vespid are definitely a welcome edition, I guess after looking at the "favored children" of the Imperials/Space Marines Codecies (painting guides ad naseum, for starters) I started to sort of squawk at the "lack of variety" in the basic Tau units. I'm probably just not thinking it through enough.

But the whole "lots of alien races working under another race" seems to be the vibe Munkie got from the Tau, and I'd sort of agree...

[themandalorian]

Just letting you know everywhere i read kind of says no to vespid. Actually going as far to say they're the worst in WH40k.

Not as cheap as kroot, yes their gun is anti space marine but really a bolter is anti vespid.



I do have a questtion though and this is what i was planning. How if the save a shaper gives to kroot? Is it worth the points.

My thinking was have some mobile tau, but also some stationary kind of like a base. Hopefull it will have forest or cover because my idea was to put kroot behind the tau. If enemies do come up use the marginally better kroot at close combat and meat shields so the tau can pick the attackers off.


Another idea was just if there is some forest, keep the kroot in there. (imagine this forest not at the back of your base but ****her out, i'm guessing your side of the playing field won't have prime cover, you'll have to go search it out)


So when the enemy assaults the kroot are in forest and can soften them up (also hear their weapons are deadly in forest) Then if they have to engage in close combat in the forest. Also have some pathfinders near there. They are near the combat not back at base, and can still run into the forest for kroot protection


ROugh idea? All i'm hearing is kroot are GOOD and underestimated in forest. So this is what i was hoping to do.

[Ikarus]

Originally Posted by minmaxticus

Here's my the general composition of my current Tau force...

1.) Two Teams of Fire Warriors w/ Drones
2.) Flight of Gun Drones
3.) Kroot with Shaper and Hounds
4.) Hammerhead
5.) Devilfish
6.) Crisis Team (Either HQ and Bodyguards or Three Regular Suits)
7.) Shadowsun
8.) Stealth Team
9.) Broadside

I would recommend -

- Another Hammerhead.
Do you equip your Hammerhead with Railgun?

- HQ Crisis - I would go solo, no need for bodyguards. They are overpriced. If you want them to be guards, then just get crisis suits then attach him to the squad. However you should capitalize on the Independent Character rule, which means, if there is a closer unit of yours witin 6'', your enemy cannot target your Crisis Commander.

- Another Broadside = if you are needing anti tank.

-Maxed out kroot squad of 20x if you haven't done so.

-2 more crisis suits possibly. You seem to be fighting light tanks I.E. Eldar and SOB. Getting Missile Suits will really nail things down.

1.) Skyray Missile Defense Ship
Reason: I like the idea of a roving artillery platform with seeker missiles that can be called in via Markerlights, and then having air support in later turns with the vehicle's burst cannons or smart missles.

IMO - huge waste of Heavy Support Choice. I would rather equip 6 seeker missiles on my Dfish/Hammerheads.

Markerlight? I can get that via FW squads w/ Markerlights, or pathfinders. I find it useless after 6 missiles, what more does that do good to you?

2.) Vespid
Reason: I need aliens! But no, really... they're gun seems pretty neat and their fleet ability would be super helpful in mobility, etc. I also dig the model the more I look at 'em.

Looks - cool. Gameplay - Do not get this. If I was an opponent, I would shoot these guys up fast and get fast points. They are one hit wonder, not even good by themselves. They will cost you points that can g

[quote]
3.) Pathfinders?
Reason: I dunno, they seem useful...
[quote]

2 points more than a fire warrior - they are definitely useful~ Railrifles also takes out powerarmour. I would run 1-2 in my army. They make good support.

4.) Ethereal
Reason: Seems like a good, cheap leader that I can throw into the army if I can't use shadowsun.

Imo, he is only good if you have a static fire warrior army.

Have you looked into getting a Crisis Suit Commander? I am shocked that you don't even use one. They are invaluable killers in a Tau army in my oppinion.


Fusion Blasers = I give them thumbs up.


Auxilliaries, no way, weak and does nothing.

KROOT - work really good if you use them what they are meant for. They are meant for soaking up hits, and also giving close combat. They also have decent guns. I would take them in max squads of 20 if I used them.


If you want an alien force... Tau aren't really the army to go that way..

[minmaxticus]

(@ the Mandalorian): I've not been impressed with the Kroot, especially the hounds. They've rolled poorly. Vespid I like because of their design and the fleet ability. The neutron blaster can be used against more then Space Marines, after all.

Ikky, you were typing/replying before I hit the respond button myself, so I'll read yours and post again/edit this one.

[themandalorian]

He's amazingggggg the god emperor

lol anyways yeah i hear lots of mixed stuff about kroot. Basically just utilize forest. Ikarus said it wasn't a bad idea and they perform good. Basically use them static, cover. How did you use them?

[minmaxticus]

Originally Posted by Ikarus

- Another Hammerhead.
Do you equip your Hammerhead with Railgun?

Yes I do. And it frequently gets shot up. Seath's wraithlord cut it in half like the second turn of a match.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

- HQ Crisis - I would go solo, no need for bodyguards. They are overpriced. If you want them to be guards, then just get crisis suits then attach him to the squad. However you should capitalize on the Independent Character rule, which means, if there is a closer unit of yours witin 6'', your enemy cannot target your Crisis Commander.

I used to do this, seeing as my box set came with three crisis suits I ran one as a HQ... then I got Shadowsun.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

- Another Broadside = if you are needing anti tank.

Noted. I'll have to use my broadside some more to get a better feel of how it works for me first.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

-Maxed out kroot squad of 20x if you haven't done so.

I'm really not impressed with my kroot. They're gun is irrelevant to me in such a shooty shooty army... and their WS leaves something to be desired. Plus, it's sinking points into speed bumps... speed bumps that have been mediocre so far for me. We'll see.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

-2 more crisis suits possibly. You seem to be fighting light tanks I.E. Eldar and SOB. Getting Missile Suits will really nail things down.

Agreed. And I like giant robots!

Originally Posted by Ikarus

IMO - huge waste of Heavy Support Choice. I would rather equip 6 seeker missiles on my Dfish/Hammerheads.

My Devilfish and Hammerhead are heavily hit on the front lines I run into situations where one of or the other gets destroyed every game... and the seeker missiles along with it. My thought is the Skyray could hang back and then move up and tank shock/support in the latter rounds.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Markerlight? I can get that via FW squads w/ Markerlights, or pathfinders. I find it useless after 6 missiles, what more does that do good to you?

Noted. I'll try putting markerlights in the FW squads.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Looks - cool. Gameplay - Do not get this. If I was an opponent, I would shoot these guys up fast and get fast points. They are one hit wonder, not even good by themselves. They will cost you points that can g

Hmmm. I'll think on them some more then.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

2 points more than a fire warrior - they are definitely useful~ Railrifles also takes out powerarmour. I would run 1-2 in my army. They make good support.

Noted.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Fusion Blasers = I give them thumbs up.

Woo!

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Auxilliaries, no way, weak and does nothing.

I would agree that it's such a huge investment, and it makes me leery... I'd probably be better off using Ogryn stats and house ruling them as another unrelated alien race in service of the tau.

Originally Posted by Ikarus

KROOT - work really good if you use them what they are meant for. They are meant for soaking up hits, and also giving close combat. They also have decent guns. I would take them in max squads of 20 if I used them.

...eh....


Thanks for the pointers, Ikky!

[minmaxticus]

Originally Posted by themandalorian

He's amazingggggg the god emperor

lol anyways yeah i hear lots of mixed stuff about kroot. Basically just utilize forest. Ikarus said it wasn't a bad idea and they perform good. Basically use them static, cover. How did you use them?

In cover, where they do okay... but then as soon as I try to speed bump the enemy, it's hardly even slowing them down. And in an army that's already shoot and with forests not being a constant on the battlefield... well...

[Ikarus]

Maybe I am a pure mechanized believing man, but I go slightly heavier on vehicles.

(Assuming your hammerhead is a railgun head)
Maybe look on getting a Ion Cannon Hammerhead? Those run Very Cheap. It places very nice 3 shot plasma killing rounds, along with its bursts. It would make a good front line tank.

Or

A Railgun hammerhead could stay back and plow enemies anyways.



My belief is this - if you want vehicles, you should pack in some numbers, or else you run into the trouble of them dieing.



As for Kroot - well its a choice thing, but if you don't need em then don't take em. I dont take them EVERY game, though they do have their uses.




Also, have you heard of the Fish of Fury Tactic?

[minmaxticus]

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Also, have you heard of the Fish of Fury Tactic?

I've read about it, I think. I've never employed it, however. One of the thing that always irritated me about the older Tau codex was it's use of "feints" and "out-thinking" in it's tactics section... for crying out loud, it's a bloody board game where everyone sees everything. I'm mean, yeah, if your opponent's a little, uh, slow... they might go hur, hur, you're not going to attack me with those kroot near by in those trees right there... or that devilfish filled with firewarriors and circling around my forces is SURELY not going to try to flank me, hur hur...

I'll try to read up on it some more.

[Ikarus]

I'll try to get some video tutorial on Fish of Fury. I'll also finish up my tactica article. It is very basic, I'll go in depth and advanced.

[minmaxticus]

Cool, thanks. I'm aware of sites out there like Advanced Tau Tactica that DO talk about Tau tactics, but like I said... I would think it'd be hard to do anything in terms of maneuvers that most players haven't seen or will be genuinely surprised by.... if I remember correctly, Fish of Fury involves using one or more Devilfish as a "wall" or distraction between your Tau and the enemy, and then loading back aboard the DF when they get too close.

[Ikarus]

Ah yeah understood. It is VERY stereotypical to see this tactic, however you seem to play the more static and ground force (is my assumptions right?) I would take the Fish of Fury tactic defensively then as a counter to close and fast units.



There aren't really much other 'maneuvers' with Tau due to the emphasis on mech vehicles if you want to move because the standard Tau guy will not want to move.

Hm.. its late for me. I'll try to think of some nice combos.

It seems like pathfinders MIGHT be the unit for you to try out. Combining them with other units might be a great synergy effect on shooting people.




Well the question comes again - what do you play most against again? Sob, IG, Eldar?

[themandalorian]

I got a good diagram of the fish of fury.

heres a couple of really cool articles. The hammerhead one looks beastly


http://advancedtautactica.com/academ...ealth_inf.html

http://advancedtautactica.com/academy/FoF.html

http://advancedtautactica.com/academ...os_attack.html


huh some reason my computer just showed me your posts, so i didn't see you talking about advanced tau tactica. anyways i've been reading funneling enemies into your static for is always good.


Hybrid team, have the moving ones move around and draw the enemy in your "base"
"

[minmaxticus]

Originally Posted by Ikarus

Well the question comes again - what do you play most against again? Sob, IG, Eldar?

Seath primarily run his Eldar against me, which includes one tank/transport, a wraithlord, a phoenixlord, and some others. Occasionally I've fought Lynx's IG, but mostly Seath's Eldar, or his SoB and Tyrannids.

[lynxrpken]

[quote=minmaxticus;91591](@ the Mandalorian): I've not been impressed with the Kroot, especially the hounds. QUOTE]

look dude I get that they suck but think about it. rapid fire 20 guys then roll down by 50%
here it is
40 dice
20 hits
10 woulds

even seath misses some saves 10 wounds you just took out 3-7 guys depending on there saves.
and lets face it against seath. every wound counts
two twenty man squds and something maybe balance out the CC here it should rock

[themandalorian]

I don't think they have a save. But if you have a shaper it gives them a +6 armor save, still higher chances, i'd get one.

[Nanolathe]

This is true, they do not have an armour save... and you have to upgrade one Kroot to a Shaper (which I recommend) and then pay an extra point per Kroot to get a 6+ armour save... which is then negated by anything with an AP... which is nearly everything.

Don't get that 6+ armour save. GW put that there, not as an upgrade, but as an insult.

[themandalorian]

So what is the shaper for them

[minmaxticus]

Originally Posted by themandalorian

So what is the shaper for them

I think that might be the point, then...

[Ikarus]

Originally Posted by minmaxticus

Seath primarily run his Eldar against me, which includes one tank/transport, a wraithlord, a phoenixlord, and some others. Occasionally I've fought Lynx's IG, but mostly Seath's Eldar, or his SoB and Tyrannids.

To me - it seems like Railguns will solve ALL these problems.

The Large Blast shot will kill ANY Aspect warrior except striking scorpions.

I would run double Railgun.





My new Army list will be coming up.. its more pathfinder tuned in mind, with lots of fire warriors, vehicles and even kroot.