My First Army *OPEN TO SUGGESTIONS*

[kenshin620]

HQ-
195-Commander(better one):Artificer Armour, Thunder Hammer, 5 stormbolter, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, master weapon, iron halo

186-Chaplain(better one):artificer armour, stormbolter, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, master weapon, melta bomb, terminator honor

Troop-
151-Marine Squad 1(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergant)

147-Marine Squad 2(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergant)

163-Marine Squad 3(6):frag and krak granades,flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergant), power weapon (sergant), plasma pistol (sergant)

123-Scout Marines(5):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergant)

Fast Attack-
185-Assault Marines(5):krak and melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergant), power fist (sergant), storm bolter (sergant), combat shield (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

Ally-
185-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergant), Brazier of Holy Fire (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armour

Total-1438
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

Let me know what you guys think

[Baron Spikey]

HQ-
195-Commander(better one)Master:Artificer Armour, Thunder Hammer, stormbolter, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, master weapon, iron halo

hes over-equipped, if he gets hit by a str8 weapon and fails his 4+ invulnerable (most things at str8 have a good enough AP to cut through even 2+ armour) then thats almost 200pts gone. dont bother with a thunder hammer, he has too good an Initiative to go last, let squad sergeants have the power fists etc- master-crafting weapons is also a waste of precious pts in a 1500pt force.

186-Chaplain(better one)Master of Sanctity:artificer armour, stormbolter, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, master weapon, melta bomb, terminator honor

same with the chaplain, give him a bolt pistol rather than a storm bolter- he's a cc guy so its cheaper to give him a pistol to get that extra attack than using T.Honours.

Troop-
151-Marine Squad 1(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergant)

with the pts your going to be saving take these guys up to 8 marines - give the plasma gun to the 3rd squad and take all the missile launchers and turn this into a devastator squad

147-Marine Squad 2(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergant)

think about taking out the missile launcher and adding in the flamer from the squad below- might as well get some use out of Cleanse & Purify, then take these guys up to 10 marines and give the sgt a power fist

163-Marine Squad 3(6):frag and krak granades,flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergant), power weapon (sergant), plasma pistol (sergant)

with the plasma gun and melta gun this squad would be a perfect anti-MEQ squad, though think about increasing the size to 8 or more.

123-Scout Marines(5):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergant)

sgt doesnt need t.honours- just a waste of pts for a fire support scout sgt

Fast Attack-
185-Assault Marines(5):krak and melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergant), power fist (sergant), storm bolter (sergant), combat shield (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

krak grenades are essentially useless so get rid of them (that goes for the tacticals and scouts too) dont give the sgt a storm bolter because as with the chaplian its a waste of his potential, remove master crafting as well and try to fit another assault marine in there- im not fond of plasma pistols but even so you dont want your sgt carrying it, if he dies because it overheats you lose your power fist.

Ally-
185-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergant), Brazier of Holy Fire (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

they're storm troopers and so unsuited to assault compared to the rest of the force- get rid of that master crafting.

103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armour

Total-1438
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

Let me know what you guys think

Both of the HQs are too pts heavy, not only should you dump some of their equipment but take one of them (i suggest the chaplain) back to its lower level i.e. reclusiarch

[kenshin620]

ah ok well I dont have any exp in this so thanks for the sugestions and well thats ALL of the models I have so I cant get any more (out o cash) plaus what do I do with the flamer in squad 3?

[Baron Spikey]

it is actually a good list in essence and im not suggesting you remove any actual models- just switch around some of the ones you've already got.

Its easy to tell that you saw the armoury and went "ooh goodies!", dont worry I had the same knee jerk action when i first started SM, and i still get it when im designing armies for other races.

EDIT: oops me- didnt see you'd said that was all the models you could have. well take one model from the plasma/melta squad and give it to the flamer squad- those are the guys who are going to have to get really up close and personal so they need the extra benefit of an even numbered squad. I still suggest you get rid of most of the wargear i suggested, just play battles at a lower pts cost than 1500pts.

[kenshin620]

oops my mistake you already said the flamer

[Torquemada Coteaz]

Well you actually don't have to drop the Chappie's rank.
I usually find it's a good deal to have the extra stats for 15 pts

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by kenshin620

ah ok well I dont have any exp in this so thanks for the sugestions and well thats ALL of the models I have so I cant get any more (out o cash) plaus what do I do with the flamer in squad 3?

play smaller sized games for now untill you can make a proper 1500pts list...
trying to stretch your forces into larger battles by tooling them all up with 'oodles of wargear will only lead to you being severly out-numbered and likely easy prey...

you have enough models however to make some really sweet 1000pts lists! plus, you'll still be able to use most/all of your models and thus, you won't be putting yourself at a massive disadvantage!
and if someone is trying to talk you into building a larger pts list than your model collection can comfortably handel, just tell them, "hey, i'm still building this army up mate - can we play 1000pts instead?" if the other guy says no and insists, then he's likely not the kind of person you really want to play against! (especially if he/she's trying to goad you as they likely are simply looking for an easy mark to make themselves look better than everyone else!)

cheers!

[kenshin620]

thx guys for all the info. well I didn't even know that I had almost 1500 points, I just kept adding the points

[r4wr89]

well undoubtedly some of the stuff i am about to say has already been brought up, but i'll say it anyways, in case i accidentally say something someone hasn't :P

Originally Posted by kenshin620

HQ-
195-Commander(better one):Artificer Armour, Thunder Hammer, 5 stormbolter, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, master weapon, iron halo

wow, this is one expensive guy. in my opinion though, i really don't think the master crafting or bionics are necessary. termie honors is cool, but for the artificer armor and iron halo, i'd probably go with one or the other-and then, probably lean towards the iron halo, it would at least give you a chance against power weapons or things with low AP values. so in essence, i think master crafting and bionics don't really need to be there, and you might want to decide on which special save you want. that should save you 30 some points ! :]

186-Chaplain(better one):artificer armour, stormbolter, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, master weapon, melta bomb, terminator honor

not bad. but i don't know if storm bolter would be so good. ithink you mentioned somewhere that most of these are already modelled ? or maybe i read wrong. but i think a BP would suit the chaplain better, especially since these guys are made for CC. again, bionics i find a little too expensive to bother with, as with the master crafting. both are cool, but i wouldn't touch them until 2, or even 3 thousand point games...then again, that's just me :P

Troop-
151-Marine Squad 1(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergant)

krak grenades are supposedly not ever worth it. i wouldn't know, i've never bothered with them since they are rumored to be such crap. frags are good though ! :] initiative 10 at things in cover is always appreciated :] as for the termie honors, generally you would want to buy something for him, like for this squad you might consider taking the storm bolter from the chappie replaced with a BP, and use that storm bolter for the sergeant instead. i find that termie honors on a sergeant isn't worth it until you get something, like a special weapon :] but again, i think you should just go with frag grenades if your squad is going to assault. the above and below squads seem to be geared more towards shooting, so you could even consider just dropping all grenades.

147-Marine Squad 2(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergant)

if you can, would you consider making this squad more similar to the one below ? i know it's been mentioned about the whole flamer deal, but if you have repetition it really helps, ie if one squad gets in a real jam you have another one that can perform the same tasks, you know ? :]

163-Marine Squad 3(6):frag and krak granades,flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergant), power weapon (sergant), plasma pistol (sergant)

ah, this is a nice squad. i have setups really similar to this. some people will give you crap about having mixed special weapons but i think it's better to be prepared for whatever comes your way, be it infantry [flamer] or tanks [melta]. the CC combo is nice too, but the plasma pistol is a bit pricey, so i would go with a bolt pistol instead....again, that's just me though, cause i really like to conserve points for more bodies :]

123-Scout Marines(5):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergant)

nice. personally, i would just go with straight sniper rifles and the missile launcher, no termie honors. that will save you a TON of points, if you drop every terminator honors on your sergeants that don't have extra special weapons, like the one in this squad. other than that, not bad ! oh, one point though, the range on all of these weapons i believe is 48", and it would likely perform best, longest, if it is kept far away from the action, thus, i wouldn't think that grenades would be worth it at all. just a thought though ! :]

Fast Attack-
185-Assault Marines(5):krak and melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergant), power fist (sergant), storm bolter (sergant), combat shield (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

okay, i think a bolt pistol would be excellent in this squad, especially since it is built for close combat. if you drop the storm bolter, the combat shield, and the master crafted wargear, that would probably save you enough points to add in 1, or even 2 more models ! i know it would mean you'd have to buy more stuff, but i think it would make it more effective :] other than that, good squad :] again, no krak grenades, just take the frags and the meltas. [the meltabombs will do what the krak grenades are supposed to do :P]

Ally-
185-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergant), Brazier of Holy Fire (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

cool squad..any excuse to use these models is fine by me :] haha. i'm not sure what the brazier does though, could anyone summarize it's abilities for me ? :]

103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armour

nice. i never take pintle mounts because they're so expensive, but all the extra firepower could make a big difference ! :]

Total-1438
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

Let me know what you guys think

cool ! all my comments are inside...but i don't know how much it helps :] i hope it helps at least a little bit though ! :]
-ant

[kenshin620]

oh the brazier is like a flamer but also counts as a CC weapon

[Lord Commander Erus]

K.... I won't adjust pts. values, but i'll go through and put in red the bare bone efficient work list under the entry, in red. Feel free to question my reasoning!

Originally Posted by kenshin620

HQ-
195-Commander(better one):Artificer Armour, Thunder Hammer, 5 stormbolter, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, master weapon, iron halo

Power weapon, Storm Bolter, Iron Halo.

186-Chaplain(better one):artificer armour, stormbolter, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, master weapon, melta bomb, terminator honor

Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack (keep bolt pistol on him. you WANT him to have that +1 attack!!

Troop-
151-Marine Squad 1(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergant)

Sergeant: Bolt Pistol, CCW. Weapons: Missile Launcher, Plasma Gun

147-Marine Squad 2(7):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergant)

Sergeant: Bolt Pistol, CCW. Weapons: Plasma Cannon, Plasma Gun (this squad can be the elite/termie hunters, with the blast plasma, the plasma gun, etc.. Also able to take out light armor.

163-Marine Squad 3(6):frag and krak granades,flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergant), power weapon (sergant), plasma pistol (sergant)

Sergeant: Bolt Pistol, CCW. Weapons: Flamer, 2x. (Use these guys as counter assault, In 1K to 1.5K, you can't afford to spend so much on your UC/sarge's!)

123-Scout Marines(5):frag and krak grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergant)

Sergeant: Bolter, CCW. Weapons: Missile Launcher, 4x Sniper Rifles

Fast Attack-
185-Assault Marines(5):krak and melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergant), power fist (sergant), storm bolter (sergant), combat shield (sergant), master weapon (sergant)

Assault Marines(5): Sergeant: Terminator Honors, Power Fist, Bolt Pistol. Marines: 2x flamerrs. (run these guys w/ the chaplain. Use 2x flamers or two x plasma. IF you drop the redundant/un-needed termie honors, you can easily afford 2x plasma, which would be better, but 2x flamer at minimum)

Ally-
185-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergant), Brazier of Holy Fire (sergant), master weapon (sergant)
Whoa.. Whoa.. Whoa... Brazier on Storm Troopers? Slow it DOOOOWN.

Storm Troopers: Krak Grenades, 2x melta guns. Sergeant: Power Fist + pistol (bolt, is my suggestion).



103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armour

I am assumign this is for the Storm Troopers to ride in. If so, just take the heavy bolter, and at your pts. value leave off the pintle. Keep the smoke and armour though.

Total-1438
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

Let me know what you guys think

Hope that helps... If you minimalize where I pointed out, you'll find whilst havign less 'bling' and lower pts. for your list, your army will be much tougher to deal with. Also, remember, a sword cna be a CCW! The defining feature of a power weapon is the painting, and I highly doubt many people will give you flak if you give the Sarges swords and in lower pts. count them as CCW. Just so long as you point the models out to your opponent before hand and explain it.

[r4wr89]

Originally Posted by kenshin620

oh the brazier is like a flamer but also counts as a CC weapon

ah i see i see. this is under WH rules right ? and i think erus did a really good job of cleaning up the list, i don't know if he did it with just his own thoughts or with all of ours, but either way i doubt the ideas of the guys who have already responded will differ too much :]

good luck bud!

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by r4wr89

ah i see i see. this is under WH rules right ? and i think erus did a really good job of cleaning up the list, i don't know if he did it with just his own thoughts or with all of ours, but either way i doubt the ideas of the guys who have already responded will differ too much :]

good luck bud!

I took mainly inspiration from you. But I also went in bare minimum mode. I tried to give every unit the most punch of it's pts. value, and to make ti the most effective. Most people forget one thing I am beginning to learn about SM, and when it is applied, they are nigh unstoppable: Precision.

Sure, you have a 3+ save, T& S 4. But you are NOT invulnerable. Not by any means. When you make each squad, set back and think this 'What role does this squad need to fulfill?'. If it is anti-tank, load up on melta guns. Etc.. Though, it is always important to try and get several multi-task units, or redundancy when it comes to key squad types like anti tank. Hence why I suggested dual plasma.

You can do anti tanking a bit w/ the cannon, very nicely terminators/HQ hunting w/ the dual plasma, and in general good anti hoarde w/ the plasma blast. Plus, if they get in rapid fire range, all those bolt shells and plasma blasts will just be pure death.

I also always recommend you make your HQ's mobile. SM HQ's are generally hunted out like crazy because of both the army/squad wide benefits they give, AND the prowess in battle. Therefore, the faster the move, the more likely your opponent is to chase his own tail trying to get them!

In all honesty, until you can field more Witch Hunter units (unless you just want to use the models you have) i'd drop the storm troopers and chimera for something else, or see if your bro would let you 'counts as' them as SM veterans or devs in a razoback or something else you list could use.

In my opinion only , of course. In the end it is your army, and the best way to play it is the way you see fit!

[kenshin620]

new list (mainly the same)
HQ-
161-Commander (master): Artificer Armour, power weapon, bolt pistol, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, iron halo

167-Chaplain (master): artificer armor, bolt pistol, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, melta bomb, terminator honor

Troop-
139-Marine Squad 1(7):frag grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

135-Marine Squad 2(7):frag grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

151-Marine Squad 3(6):frag grenades, flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergeant), power weapon (sergeant), plasma pistol (sergeant)

113-Scout Marines(5):frag grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergeant)

Fast Attack-
160-Assault Marines(5): melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergeant), power fist (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant), combat shield (sergeant),

Ally-
170-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergeant), stormbolter (sergeant)

103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armor

126-Dominion Squad(6):frag grenades, 4 meltaguns, Veteran Superior, CCW and boltpistol (superior)

73-Immolator:twin heavy flamers, smoke launchers, extra armor

Total-1428
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by kenshin620

new list (mainly the same)
HQ-
161-Commander (master): Artificer Armour, power weapon, bolt pistol, bionics, meltabomb, terminator honor, iron halo
Loose the artificer armor. You'll likely (or you should) be putting him in a squad of marines, which means he can't use that 2+ save because of the mixed armor rule. Also, bionics is way over priced.

167-Chaplain (master): artificer armor, bolt pistol, bionics, frag grenades, jump pack, melta bomb, terminator honor
Same as the Master

Troop-
139-Marine Squad 1(7):frag grenades, missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)
good actually. Very good. Perhaps loose the frags, as these guys are geared for shooting.

135-Marine Squad 2(7):frag grenades, missile launcher, flamer, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)
Again... If you keep both, you can't use one or the either. Count the flamer as a modified plasma gun, or something. Having a flamer + missile or melta + missile is wasteful in pts, and will severely hamper you.

151-Marine Squad 3(6):frag grenades, flamer(missile launcher), melta gun, terminator honor (sergeant), power weapon (sergeant), plasma pistol (sergeant)
Same as above.

113-Scout Marines(5):frag grenades, missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles, terminator honor (sergeant)
Take the frags off. Snipers do NOT need frags. And take the honors off the sarge. Why give it to him if he has nothing useful he can buy to help the squad? He doesn't need + 1 attack, so just take it off.

Fast Attack-
160-Assault Marines(5): melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergeant), power fist (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant), combat shield (sergeant),
Take off the combat shield and you're golden.You can have the shield modeled on and not have to have a 'combat shield' bit of wargear.

Ally-
170-Stormtroopers(10):krak grenades, melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergeant), stormbolter (sergeant)
Kraks grenades really aren't strong enough to make much of a difference for this squad. And why, if you have short range 'nade launcher AND melta, does the sergeant have a long ranged, two-handed storm bolter? Give him a bolt pistol to help the power weapon out.

103-Chimera:multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armor
This one still could be better, but it's ok really.

Total-1299
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

There my take man. It's shaping up.

[kenshin620]

HQ-
136-Commander (master): power weapon, bolt pistol, meltabomb, terminator honor, iron halo

142-Chaplain (master): bolt pistol, frag grenades, jump pack, melta bomb, terminator honor

Troop-
132-Marine Squad 1(7): missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

132-Marine Squad 2(7): missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

151-Marine Squad 3(6):frag grenades, flamer(missile launcher pts), melta gun, terminator honor (sergeant), power weapon (sergeant), plasma pistol (sergeant)

93-Scout Marines(5): missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles

Fast Attack-
155-Assault Marines(5): melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergeant), power fist (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

Ally-
141-Stormtroopers(10): melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

103-Chimera: multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armor

126-Dominion Squad(6):frag grenades, 4 meltaguns, Veteran Superior, CCW and boltpistol (superior)

73-Immolator:twin heavy flamers, smoke launchers, extra armor

Total-1384
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

How is my cleaned up list?

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by kenshin620

HQ-
136-Commander (master): power weapon, bolt pistol, meltabomb, terminator honor, iron halo

142-Chaplain (master): bolt pistol, frag grenades, jump pack, melta bomb, terminator honor

Troop-
132-Marine Squad 1(7): missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

132-Marine Squad 2(7): missile launcher, plasma gun, terminator honor (sergeant), CC weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

151-Marine Squad 3(6):frag grenades, flamer(missile launcher pts), melta gun, terminator honor (sergeant), power weapon (sergeant), plasma pistol (sergeant)

93-Scout Marines(5): missile launcher, 4 sniper rifles

Fast Attack-
155-Assault Marines(5): melta bombs, 1 plasma pistol, terminator honor (sergeant), power fist (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

Ally-
141-Stormtroopers(10): melta gun, grenade launcher, power weapon (sergeant), bolt pistol (sergeant)

103-Chimera: multilaser, heavy bolter, pintle storm bolter, smoke launchers, extra armor

126-Dominion Squad(6):frag grenades, 4 meltaguns, Veteran Superior, CCW and boltpistol (superior)

73-Immolator:twin heavy flamers, smoke launchers, extra armor

Total-1384
Chapter Advantage-Cleanse and Purify
Chapter Disadvantage-Faithful unto Death

How is my cleaned up list?

Now that list.. I LOVE... Nice, up in your face, and even a faith point.. For your future expansion... Seraphims, and a cannones with a jump pack and some other goodies.

[wolfpack]

Good man keep the pintle mounts...they aren't that expensive (10 points) and the extra dice in your shooting phase is always a plus...

Also when you have the opportunity...I would include a dread in yer army...set up with a power fist and flamer and a plasma cannon of his own makes for a nice mix of anti tank/anti personnel