Sentarus IG (Black Saints homeworld force!)

[Lord Commander Erus]

Update On Page 2: Revised doctrines and list!


Carapace Armor (I like the 4+ save, and plus, they are elite, hardened men of an SM chapter.. And it says they can be in plate mail! I could dress them like heavily armored romans!!)
Warrior Weapons
Ogryn Squads
Die-Hards
Xenos Fighters (Eldar) - Because of the fluff of the Dark Eldar and Eldar ravaging the planet, and because my fiancee plays Eldar!!

Those are the traits I believe that best fit the fluff, and are the most fun to play. Before I devise a list, i'd love advice, on both list building and doctrines! The force of this will be around 1.5K, with super heavies added on. At least a storm sword and probably a valkyrie or so.

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by Lord Commander Erus

Carapace Armor (I like the 4+ save, and plus, they are elite, hardened men of an SM chapter.. And it says they can be in plate mail! I could dress them like heavily armored romans!!)
Warrior Weapons
Ogryn Squads
Die-Hards
Xenos Fighters (Eldar) - Because of the fluff of the Dark Eldar and Eldar ravaging the planet, and because my fiancee plays Eldar!!

Those are the traits I believe that best fit the fluff, and are the most fun to play. Before I devise a list, i'd love advice, on both list building and doctrines! The force of this will be around 1.5K, with super heavies added on. At least a storm sword and probably a valkyrie or so.

hmmmm... i'm not a fan of warrior weapons simply because it really does make your entire army very single-minded. more oftend than not, a combined assault force + rapid firing platoon can solve most problems! a whole hoard of screaming madmen, while good fun, kinda gets blown to little bits before it does much damage!
ogryns too are a leary option. eldar have a tonne of S8 weapons and so they make a huge mess of ogryns. (who can't take carapace armour either!) a single shining spear exarch w/star lance can crush half a unit of ogryns by themselves for example!

also, for the valkyrie to work, you'll need the drop troops doctrine as the very sub-par storm troopers are the only other unit capable of taking one! (and yes, they are indeed a dedicated transport!)

iron discipline is killer for any guard list; regroup even when below half and no modifier for being below 50% starting strength? yes please! combined with die-hards, your troops will stick around till the time of ragnarok decends! (i once had a single guardsman stand firm against a lictor + 2 ravenors + 8 genestealers + 12 hormagaunts! too bad it ment i couldn't shoot the buggers though as it was my turn next...)

veterans is a must IMHO for an assault/close combat guard list. those hidden power fists will make your units deadly, plus the ability to combine shotguns & close combat weapons in the same squad means along with upto 3 special weapons means you've for once got a very flexable unit!

oh, and for your 'artillery', i suggest a pair of griffon mortars w/infernus shells... rude, just plain rude!

cheers!

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by experiment 626

hmmmm... i'm not a fan of warrior weapons simply because it really does make your entire army very single-minded. more oftend than not, a combined assault force + rapid firing platoon can solve most problems! a whole hoard of screaming madmen, while good fun, kinda gets blown to little bits before it does much damage!
ogryns too are a leary option. eldar have a tonne of S8 weapons and so they make a huge mess of ogryns. (who can't take carapace armour either!) a single shining spear exarch w/star lance can crush half a unit of ogryns by themselves for example!

also, for the valkyrie to work, you'll need the drop troops doctrine as the very sub-par storm troopers are the only other unit capable of taking one! (and yes, they are indeed a dedicated transport!)

iron discipline is killer for any guard list; regroup even when below half and no modifier for being below 50% starting strength? yes please! combined with die-hards, your troops will stick around till the time of ragnarok decends! (i once had a single guardsman stand firm against a lictor + 2 ravenors + 8 genestealers + 12 hormagaunts! too bad it ment i couldn't shoot the buggers though as it was my turn next...)

veterans is a must IMHO for an assault/close combat guard list. those hidden power fists will make your units deadly, plus the ability to combine shotguns & close combat weapons in the same squad means along with upto 3 special weapons means you've for once got a very flexable unit!

oh, and for your 'artillery', i suggest a pair of griffon mortars w/infernus shells... rude, just plain rude!

cheers!

I just liked the idea of auto pistols on everyone, and swords! SWORDS! Though if I took veterans *scrambles off to builder*

I can't seem to find where shotguns can be combined w/ close combat weapons, though I could give shotguns to everyone... Mayhaps a suggestion of how you'd set up the squad? I very much want this to be like the saints. Very deadly, very fast.

[r4wr89]

wow erus, this sounds like CC ig all over again..haha. and not only that, expensive CC IG. but it's you i'm talking to so i suppose i'm okay with it :] lol

anyways, i think stitch would be a better source of information...despite that i definitely would have to encourage iron discipline or close order drill perhaps? something to boost leadership and such, especially for CC cause even with carapace armor...well, they're still IG :] close order drill is also free, and iron discipline is barely any points at all, which would be nice since your infantry squads are 15, 20 points more expensive than usual ?

die hards, i can't remember which trait that is, hmm. i'l have to look it up again..haha

but is this list reallyonly so you can field super heavies ? :P i've been devising an inquisitor + mechanized IG force to go with my marines for almost a year now...and with the advent of apoc, it only gets better for you and me, eh ? :]

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by r4wr89

wow erus, this sounds like CC ig all over again..haha. and not only that, expensive CC IG. but it's you i'm talking to so i suppose i'm okay with it :] lol

anyways, i think stitch would be a better source of information...despite that i definitely would have to encourage iron discipline or close order drill perhaps? something to boost leadership and such, especially for CC cause even with carapace armor...well, they're still IG :] close order drill is also free, and iron discipline is barely any points at all, which would be nice since your infantry squads are 15, 20 points more expensive than usual ?

die hards, i can't remember which trait that is, hmm. i'l have to look it up again..haha

but is this list reallyonly so you can field super heavies ? :P i've been devising an inquisitor + mechanized IG force to go with my marines for almost a year now...and with the advent of apoc, it only gets better for you and me, eh ? :]

It's not only. It's also because i've always liked the fluff of IG, I just can't STAND shooty armies. A 1.5K of troops etc.. is small enough, and when attached to the Black Saints, mean I have CC goodness!

[r4wr89]

ah i see, yea i had a similar idea of using this new IG force to bring or support elements that my space marines weren't designed for.

sounds cool, i am excited to see this list :]

[Lord Commander Erus]

So... UC of the vets with bolt pistol and power fist? And the rest with shotguns, except for three with meltas? Or... No???

[Templar Mikeel]

Yes, yes. Take the Close Order Drill doctrine. +1 Attack when in formation will be a great bonus for your CC IG.

[Lord Commander Erus]

So then... Close Order Drill or Xenos-Fighter: Eldar.... The homeworld planet, and indeed military styles developed in response to Dark Eldar raids and Eldar attacks to regain relics left by their race long ago. So I nabbed the Xenos-Fighter... But Close Order and a good, solid theme to the force might work?

Also... What superheavies beyond all bane blade variants, and what fliers are available to the IG?

[Templar Mikeel]

Um, IDK. Maybe the Macharius Baneblade, Malcador, and perhaps the Gorgon for super heavies. for fliers, I don't know if it goes beyond Valykries and Vultures.

We are talking fluff, right?

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by Templar Mikeel

Um, IDK. Maybe the Macharius Baneblade, Malcador, and perhaps the Gorgon for super heavies. for fliers, I don't know if it goes beyond Valykries and Vultures.

We are talking fluff, right?

Yes. Where they take heavies, they are HEAVY. Huge, massive firepower. No middle ground (like no hell hounds, as much as I like them). What Exactly is the Gorgon and Macharius Baneblade? Not up on them.

Any fliers should be light, and FAST. That's the fluff.

[Templar Mikeel]

Originally Posted by Lord Commander Erus

Yes. Where they take heavies, they are HEAVY. Huge, massive firepower. No middle ground (like no hell hounds, as much as I like them). What Exactly is the Gorgon and Macharius Baneblade? Not up on them.

Any fliers should be light, and FAST. That's the fluff.

I got all that from Forge World. A Gorgon is a huge transport originally for the DKoK that can carry up to 50 models. The Macharius Baneblade is also originally for the DKoK. It's basicly a rip-off Baneblade that can have different turret options.

[That_Guy]

Here is an idea. Get lots of mortars. Mortars are basicaly G''48 1 shot heavy bolter. There a plenty of good benefits, particularly:
1) They are dirt cheap. 80 points for three of them. You can easily stack these bad boys up.
2)They have good range. They tend to scatter, but if you have a lot of them, it won't be too bad of range.
3)You can stay out of sight. Whats better than attacking your opponent, and your opponent can't get you back?
4) Most importantly, it pins. THe art of pinning is misunderstod, because there are so many high leadership units, that they forget about them. Dont underestamate the art of pinning. Pinning, when it works, will drop the entire squad to the ground, as they cower for cover. They lose the entire next turn of any shooting or movement. This will complement your CC troops very well. When you fire, concentrate all mortars on a single unit at a time, and dont forget to tell him to keep rolling for pinning tests. You will either pin him, or so badly maul the squad that it becomes ineffective. If your mortars pin, fire the remaining mortars at another target.
Once the target is pinned, run in. Dont attack the pinned enemy, since they are gone for a turn, let them lie untill your next turn. Focus on the immediat threats.

Great to pin the heavy weapons groups, so you relieve a lot of preasure from your assaulting troops.

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by Templar Mikeel

I got all that from Forge World. A Gorgon is a huge transport originally for the DKoK that can carry up to 50 models. The Macharius Baneblade is also originally for the DKoK. It's basicly a rip-off Baneblade that can have different turret options.

Can you link me? I'm running like 20 IM's and playing with lists.

[That_Guy]

Oh, and a tip to defeating DE.

Destroy their transports and vehicals right away. They lose that, and they lose what makes them DE, mobility. Forget about the rest of them, focus everything you can on vechs, and your in the green.

[Templar Mikeel]

Originally Posted by That_Guy

Here is an idea. Get lots of mortars. Mortars are basicaly G''48 1 shot heavy bolter. There a plenty of good benefits, particularly:
1) They are dirt cheap. 80 points for three of them. You can easily stack these bad boys up.
2)They have good range. They tend to scatter, but if you have a lot of them, it won't be too bad of range.
3)You can stay out of sight. Whats better than attacking your opponent, and your opponent can't get you back?
4) Most importantly, it pins. THe art of pinning is misunderstod, because there are so many high leadership units, that they forget about them. Dont underestamate the art of pinning. Pinning, when it works, will drop the entire squad to the ground, as they cower for cover. They lose the entire next turn of any shooting or movement. This will complement your CC troops very well. When you fire, concentrate all mortars on a single unit at a time, and dont forget to tell him to keep rolling for pinning tests. You will either pin him, or so badly maul the squad that it becomes ineffective. If your mortars pin, fire the remaining mortars at another target.
Once the target is pinned, run in. Dont attack the pinned enemy, since they are gone for a turn, let them lie untill your next turn. Focus on the immediat threats.

Great to pin the heavy weapons groups, so you relieve a lot of preasure from your assaulting troops.

Also, they're good for stopping or slowing a large, grouped assault.

Originally Posted by Lord Commander Erus

Can you link me? I'm running like 20 IM's and playing with lists.

here yah go

[Lord Commander Erus]

I LOVE those tanks... Hmmmm.. Vulcan Mega, AND more! And a Storm Sword.

I think I might take one platoon loaded with mortars just to do what you suggested man!

[hairyyahoo]

good kit for cc vets would be a fist on the serge, 2 flamers and a melta (or vice versa), 3 shotguns and 3 pistol and ccw combos. if you're feeling fruity you can add the honourifica to the serge for a bit of extra hitting power. vets count as guard infantry so you can apply your other doctrines to them too.

[Lord Commander Erus]

Hairy, given you heard the History on the home world for the Black Saints (Sentarus), what would you suggest for a fifth doctrine?