you have to be a total idiot to not equip officers with a bolt pistol

[kenshin620]

Right?

[Ikarus]

A one liner post... but i'll see where we get to...


how many points is it to equip?


In reality... a bolter would blast a IG guys arm off..... but I guess... if its like 1-3 points then its fine. If it is 5 points, its a waste. Unless you got extra points space for it.

[experiment 626]

for only a single point, every veteran sergeant and officer should have at least a bolt pistol or bolter...

all officers should also have power toys as they are also a gloriously cheap price!
now if you want to be really daring, you can always try a power fist on those heroic senior officers - it's quite funny to see a marine player's face when they forget to target your officer and then you start killing his/her marines on 2's in an assault!

cheers!

[Spartan2154]

Is it cool to have a plasms pistol? or does that make me a doof?

i mean, just as good right?

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by Spartan2154

Is it cool to have a plasms pistol? or does that make me a doof?

i mean, just as good right?

on a vet sergeant? sure why not! if he does die to his pistol overheating, it's kinda funny...

for a junior officer though it's a dumb choice because he only has 1 wound. but he gives his Ld to all nearby units and can take insane skills like iron discipline.
giving him a gun which can easily kill him when he still only has a BS3 is a surefire way to set yourself up for a crushing defeat! (because as we all know, you always misfire that plasma weapon at the very worst moment possible!)

heroic senior officers at least have 3 wounds an BS4 making them a better candidate for that plasma pistol. i still wouldn't recomend rapid firing it however unless you have a medic among his command staff!

cheers!

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by experiment 626

for only a single point, every veteran sergeant and officer should have at least a bolt pistol or bolter...

all officers should also have power toys as they are also a gloriously cheap price!
now if you want to be really daring, you can always try a power fist on those heroic senior officers - it's quite funny to see a marine player's face when they forget to target your officer and then you start killing his/her marines on 2's in an assault!

cheers!

Really? I would think the last place you want a vet sarge or anything is near an assault, and thereby giving him a power weapon is liking giving a pyro a gas soaked jacket.. It just doesn't seem smart to me.

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by Lord Commander Erus

Really? I would think the last place you want a vet sarge or anything is near an assault, and thereby giving him a power weapon is liking giving a pyro a gas soaked jacket.. It just doesn't seem smart to me.

most sergeant actually can't take power toys in a guard army... only storm trooper, rough rider & hardened veteran sergeants actually get the option.
all officers should at the very least have power toys because they're IC's and thus they're rather vulnerable in assaults. (but they can target their attacks!)

and even with a whole guard army at your disposal, enemy assaults are inevitable... sooner or later the enemy will get their hands/talons/poisonous claws on you! having a couple of models capable of holding their own for a round or two is a must.
plus, the mission objective might even force you to abandon the gun-line syndrom and move about! (for example; take and hold, rescue, recon, break-out or even clense and patrol missions.)

cheers!

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by experiment 626

if he does die to his pistol overheating, it's kinda funny...

The best overheating was the "stupid marine" story that me and my friend made up...

I had destoryed his entire crusader squad, and he only had one marine w/ a plasma gun left. The thing is, when I shot at him, I kept missing! So... his turn comes around, and he fires his gun... he overheats... he blows himself up.

It was just so funny because we both said that was exactly what was going to happen, and then we added the "stupid marine" story too...

[experiment 626]

i had a similar incident too the last time i played a game against my store's manager;

my last 2 models were a vet sergeant w/plasma pistol & a plasma gunner.
in a last act of retribution, i decided to rapid fire both guns into the rear of a rhino.
my rolls to-hit were; three 1's & one 2. i failed all 3 armour saves with a further roll of two 1's & one 2.
it took about 5 minutes for everyone, including myself, to stop laughing!

(note: this was back during 3rd edition so you still only overheated on a 1 even when rapid firing...)

cheers!

[lynxrpken]

I arm with plasma pistol and every now and then I suffer for this but if it is master crafted it helps with the overheating problem( how many times do you think you are going to roll a one two times in a row

[JoeGuardsman]

To say you are stupid to not take a bolt pistol when you can even when it is really cheap isn't right really. Officers side arms are fairly in consequential, unless we are talking about a plasma pistol that might kill them or you. I've had a handful of times where a bolt pistol killed a model that a laspistol wouldn't have wounded but it isn't enough for me to go remodeling all of my minis or miss out on a special weapon for another squad.
I have started to equip more people with power weapons however. The cost is incredibly cheap and I feel the loss of casualties keenly when I know I would have killed them with a power weapon. Though I'm sure I wouldn't have rolled those 5s and 6s if I had taken them.

[all-lucky7777]

I agree with JoeGuardsman. I also agree with the OP, at least halfway. All my shooty guard squads (basic squads) have a sarge with a bolter. I think that a vet is a better choice than the vox because of this (and the stormbolter, etc), you get cool extra guns, but you miss out on a better and more difficult to reduce leadership. I occasionally double up on the vox and the vet, but thats a different post...

I don't like putting Bolt Pistols on anything that doesn't need it modeled on because the model is going to shoot it once, if he's an exceedingly lucky bastard twice, and it isn't that much better than the laspistol to begin with. A plas pistol on the other hand has the potential to mess something up, but consider this: What will you be charging that requires such strength and AP that you actually expect to live through the combat with? Again, 10 points for one shot.

I HAVE found a use for the Plasma Pistol. Its expensive, but it works wonders for Guard's AP Problems (or so I would think). I'm not gonna thread hijack but I'm not gonna post it here either, I'm gonna go start a thread about it now.

[lynxrpken]

Originally Posted by experiment 626

all officers should at the very least have power toys because they're IC's and thus they're rather vulnerable in assaults. (but they can target their attacks!)



cheers!

I did not know officers can target modles to be there attack vick

[Steellegioncpt]

Is this a joke?!

The bolt pistol is the only thing that I equip my officers with, that and a power weapon (some times!)

Its 1 (one) point! and it has the stats of a bolter. Why would you do anything else!? Well lets take a look at our options!

Plasma pistol (Wrong) boy do I want to sink in 10 more points to a model that may not even use it! Since officers are suppose to be in the rear of combat. Finally Overheat! I dont need to go on about that

Las pistol (wrong) why do that when its the same cost to give it a kick butt bolt pistol.

Any other type of CC weapon (In addition to a power weapon) WELL you should never/extremely rarely equip an officer with a power fist the points is amazingly high you can basicly get 4 more guardsmen for that cost.


Take it from me whos been playing guard since 2nd edition please

[all-lucky7777]

I don't take bolt pistols for the same reason you don't take plasma pistols. Its one shot you may never need.

And I don't think that officers should be in the rear, at least not necessarily. A Regimental standard bearer is an extremely underrated model. If you take your command squad with a Priest OR Commissar for added punch and some more wounds, a standard, and 3 CC vets (maybe with stormbolters!), along with kitted out HSO, then you can have it rush to support models in CC. Chimeras help too, but its expensive. I'd just put the squad in the center of my formation. This means that the Guard squads won't be running as often and they might actually win cause of the +1 combat res. This helps a LOT (believe it or not) against choppy armies, but I'm still working out the kinks in tourney play, because its wasted points against necrons or Thousand Sons or something. But this way you can have your officers lead from the front. After all, a master vox is much less useful if you happen to have your officer in range of the Leadership rule. (and Iron Discipline Maybe!)

This has been another squad organization concept, brought to you by Lucky.

[Elzanith]

But who doesn't love exploding weapons that take out there own team? i mean come on.....everyone laughs when a guys pistol blows up =D

[Steellegioncpt]

Originally Posted by all-lucky7777

I don't take bolt pistols for the same reason you don't take plasma pistols. Its one shot you may never need.

And I don't think that officers should be in the rear, at least not necessarily. A Regimental standard bearer is an extremely underrated model. If you take your command squad with a Priest OR Commissar for added punch and some more wounds, a standard, and 3 CC vets (maybe with stormbolters!), along with kitted out HSO, then you can have it rush to support models in CC. Chimeras help too, but its expensive. I'd just put the squad in the center of my formation. This means that the Guard squads won't be running as often and they might actually win cause of the +1 combat res. This helps a LOT (believe it or not) against choppy armies, but I'm still working out the kinks in tourney play, because its wasted points against necrons or Thousand Sons or something. But this way you can have your officers lead from the front. After all, a master vox is much less useful if you happen to have your officer in range of the Leadership rule. (and Iron Discipline Maybe!)

This has been another squad organization concept, brought to you by Lucky.

I guess when it comes down to it is: How many officers?

I would never run ALL my officers up front, but i can see why you would need to. Also if you are running officers to the front, I dont see a bolt pistol being a wasted shot.

All in all you have to pay for a weapon, be it las pistol or bolt pistol. and since the two are the exact same price then its obvious as to which weapon you should choose.

[all-lucky7777]

No, officers come with laspistol and CCW setup built in, the BP is an 'upgrade'.

Also, I never said anything about my officers running anywhere, becuase my guard squads aren't running much either. They set up and shoot, they might reposition but the command squad simply counterattacks where the fighting is. Even if they don't get into combat in the first initial round of CC, they give the benefit of the standard if they are within 12" once all hell breaks loose and some chaos/ork warlord comes barreling through my ranks.

And I agree, I don't usually send my officers to the front, it just isn't very imperial. I'm just saying theres got to be a viable tactic for leading from the front besides Colonel-Commissar Gaunt. I use the mobile firesupport setup of HSO with stormbolter & power sword, 2 Veteran Guardsmen with Stormbolters, one with a standard and one with a medpack, 2 Grenade launchers and a sanctioned psyker.

But thats a different post, I've hijacked Kenshin's thread enough already.

[lynxrpken]

in the end I think most of this can be cleared up by saying that it really depends on what it is you are going to use the squad for.
I arm at least two officers in my army with plasma pistols and will continue to do so. I also field a commisar in the command squad with a power fist. I also have at the least a missel launcher in my command section as well.

why do I do this. because perhaps foolishly I use my command section to go tank hunting. in a chimera with 2 heavy bolters I can speed into light tanks unload fire missle launcher and plasma pistol against the rear armor and on the off chance that does not work I have the power fist assault phase to fall back on. if I can take it out shooting I keep something back to fire with if there is something is in the tank. like maybe 10 storm troopers one grenade launcher should put a hole in a unit emerging from a chimera or rhino.