Krieg Doctrines

[Templar Mikeel]

I have a few ideas for how the organization and Force Organization Chart for the DKoK work.

The DKoK represented in Imperial Armor 5 are a siege regiment. How about in our codex we introduce some new kinds of Death Korp regiments. Tell me what you think of this:

There are 3 or 4 different regimental doctrines to choose from, Siege Company, Armored Company, Line Company, or anything else you all can think of. Only one Regimental Doctrine can be chosen, and each doctrine dictates which units you can choose. After choosing a Regimental Doctrine, 4 other doctrines can be chosen for your Regiment, much like Codex Imperial Guard. However, each Regimental Doctrine has it's own separate doctrines.

Armored Kompany
Basically the same as the normal ArCo rules, but I think we should introduce a few new tanks, like the Macharius and a few DIY tanks.

Siege Kompany
Exactly the same as IA 5, but maybe with a few additional units that we think of (like DKoK Engineers!)

Line Kompany
This is where we would get to have some fun and build the rules from scratch. I was thinking of the Line Kompany as a static army that relied on the enemy coming to them, and annihilating them in a war of attrition. Ideally, they would have few, if any, tanks, and made use of large amounts of infantry, and weapon emplacements as heavy support choices. I was also bumping around the idea of giving them the ability to deploy defenses like trenches, razor wire, and tank traps, much like the Cities of Death stratagems.

So, your thoughts? Does this line up with the Death Korp of Krieg background, and do you think it's a good idea that we should use for the codex?

[Stubber]

Originally Posted by Templar Mikeel

Line Kompany
This is where we would get to have some fun and build the rules from scratch. I was thinking of the Line Kompany as a static army that relied on the enemy coming to them, and annihilating them in a war of attrition. Ideally, they would have few, if any, tanks, and made use of large amounts of infantry, and weapon emplacements as heavy support choices. I was also bumping around the idea of giving them the ability to deploy defenses like trenches, razor wire, and tank traps, much like the Cities of Death stratagems.

I like the Idea of this but you would need to have tonnes of fortifications to represent it with any kind of autenticity.
Having a handful of 6" lenghts of razorwire and tank traps just won't do it.

[Baron von Lexus]

Good call here Mikeel, I'd even add more units, but we can see what we come up with. I mean you could even make Drop Troops work as Sappers/Tunnelers.

Krieg can really fit an type of regimental organization with the exception of straight up Drop Troops.

[Templar Mikeel]

Ok. So do you think this will work with the Codex? Any other additional ideas for doctrines?

[Baron von Lexus]

Well a mechanized infantry regiment seems plausible to me. Light Infantry Recon, Heavy Infantry(Grenadier) Regiment, and Armored Cavalry (Death riders and tanks) as well would work.

And the default 'doctrine' choices for any Krieg are:
Hardened Fighters
Die Hards
Iron Discipline

[Captain Slow]

armoured company:
now, before anyone huffs, sighs and swears blindly just at the mention of this army; this is My opnioin of how an armoured company should be, and its not the horrible gank mobile that your thinking, Ive pretty much taken it bach to the drawing board.
Why? with 5th edition round the corner, and the fact that 'troops' as in infantry models, are the only units in the game that can claim objectives. so that leaves an armored company with only two outcomes in a normal 1500pts game. draw, or lose. simple, tanks cannot claim objectives, but they can contest them.

My version of an armoured company:
before i started this, i knew i would have to put a krieg spin on it, as it is for the kreig codex, and btw, this is completely open for disscussion, this is my opninion. if you think something needs changeing, tell me. tell everyone, lets sit down and disscuss it.

anyway, enough babbleing; the army list:

HQ:
Company Commander:
(the only HQ choice for the army, he can either be acompanyed by a command squad with a chimera as a transport unit. OR he can be in a tank, and he must pay for the tank at the apporpriate points cost ((the tank also increases its BS by 1 ALSO the tank (and if the commander chooses to have a command squad, this upgrade is represented on his transport choice) comes with the improved comms upgrade free.))

ELITES:
Storm troopers/Grenadiers:
(as in the imperial guard codex / IA:5 ((however, the squad must be mounted in a transport vehicle of somekind)) )

Rough Riders/Death Riders:
(as they appear in codex imperial guard/ IA:5

Tech Priest enginseer/Watchman:
(as they appear in codex imperial guard/ IA:5 ((again, must have a transport vehicle for the squad))

Comissar:
(as with the advisors rules in the imperial guard codex.)

TROOPS:
Armoured Fist Squad:
(as it appears in the imperial guard codex)

Tank units:
(for every company commnader mounted in a tank up may choose up to two units from the following list: Leman russ, Leman Russ Exterminator, Leman Russ Conqueror. Each Unit chosen this way will count as one troops choice on the FOC )

FAST ATTACK:
Sentinel Squadron:
(as they appear in the imperial guard codex)

Reconnissance Section:
(you may choose one of the following units that take up 1 fast attack choice per vehicle: Hellhound, salamander scout vehicle)

HEAVY SUPPORT:
Support Tank:
Unit size: One Vehicle
(The support tank must be chosen from one of the following: Leamn russ demolisher, Leman russ conqueror, Imperial destroyer tank hunter)

Heavy Support Tank:
(chosen from the following list at the appropriate points cost: IMPERIAL MACHARIUS HEAVY TANK, IMPERIAL MACHARIUS VANQUISHER HEAVY TANK, IMPERIAL MACHARIUS VULCAN HEAVY TANK. Eac h tank chosen takes up 1 Heavy support Slot and 1 troops choice slot ((my reasoning behind this is, machirus tanks are heavy support tanks, they require extra man power to arm, re-fuel and operate in a thetre of war. so the army has to have a few negative points to represent this)) )

Artillery vehicle:
Unit size: one vehicle
(the artillery vehiucle must be chosen from the following list: Basilisk, Griffon, Medusa heavy mortar, Hydra Flak tank (( why have i included the medusa and the hydra? well, flyers are becoming more common place in games of 40K at least, In my experiance, so this way theu have a legal counter unit, the hydra. and the medusa, i think its a funky unit, i'll be happy to remove it if anyone has any objections. i just thought it fitted in with the krieg doctroines nicely, being a mobile seige tank and all.)) )


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well, that is the Krieg armoured company army list, as i see it.
I've tried to make it 4th Ed and 5th Ed friendly, while not loose anything.
Theres plenty in there, and it gives the player making the armylist, the options (if they want to) to make a gank mobile army list. but never win a game via objectives, OR they can create an army list that can win games by taking objectives, (EG: the armoured fist squads, or the death riders, grenadiers etc etc.)

so, whats everyones opinioins?
or have i jumped the gun abit here?

[Baron von Lexus]

No I think thats good, it has solid rules as well as solid fluff. It needs some cleaning up but I'd like to put it in to the codex.

[Templar Mikeel]

Maybe I love tanks too much, but in my opinion, it seems a bit too much like a mechanized infantry army and less like an armored company. But, you do have a good point. With the objective claiming rules for 5th edition, ArCo will become almost obsolete.

tanks cannot claim objectives

True. And, armored companies aren't intended to take objectives, they're made for smashing aside all resistance and letting the infantry take the objective. But, you already know that.

So what do we do with this dilemma?

[Baron von Lexus]

Offer Both! Krieg style!

I mean it's just another page or two

[Templar Mikeel]

After thinking a bit more, and re-reading Slow's idea, I like it a lot. A choice of tanks and infatry for Troops is great. I think that the same could be applied to HQ as well. Give the option for command tanks, or command squads in Chimeras.
What about moving the Storm Troopers in Chimeras to the Fast Attack section, along with the Death Riders, and giving them Tank options for Elites?

[Baron von Lexus]

Please Please the correct term is Grenadiers... but ya thats not bad, maybe take some SP Artillery as well representing the more mechanized/armored feel of the organization??

[Templar Mikeel]

I think it's time we move forward and get these doctrines hammered out. So far we have:

Siege Company
Armored Company
Infantry Company/Line Company
Recon Company
Trench Raiders
Mechanised Infantry

First off we need to decide what units each doctrine is allowed. Some will be easier than others, especially the Siege company. Rather than tackle them all at once, you all want to move down the list and figure it out, starting with the Siege Company? Ok, lets do it.

Siege Kompany
The Siege Kompany uses the DKoK list from Imperial Armor volume 5. What units should we add? The concept of adding an Engineer/Sapper unit has been tossed around a little. Could we add the option for Basilisk tanks?
What else should we do for the Siege Kompany list?

[Baron von Lexus]

Just a nitpicky thing but instead of company lets expand it to regiment. As for the siege list I think we can stick to the IA rules as they are pretty unique and are the basis for a organization like that. I do think that we should add in Engineers in dome capacity. Basiliks should be in the Armored or Mechanised Infantry regiments.

[Templar Mikeel]

Ok, so how should we kit the Engineers? Shotguns as base weapons, and they can take flamers or missile launchers? Give them the option to buy demo charges and wire cutters too. Also, would the ability to buy the USR infiltration be too much?

[Baron von Lexus]

I think maybe add meltas as an option too. We could make some sort of special rule that they can clear terrain or set up minefields or soemthing. Infiltration would make sense too.

[Templar Mikeel]

Good idea! (shouldn't you be heading to Europe right now?)

Ok, first draft of the Engineer squad. I think I forgot a few things, the points might be a bit high, and they might be too powerful.

[Baron von Lexus]

(I leave in an hour or so to go to the airport.)
I cant open that file for some reason.

[Wakim]

Originally Posted by Templar Mikeel

Good idea! (shouldn't you be heading to Europe right now?)

Ok, first draft of the Engineer squad. I think I forgot a few things, the points might be a bit high, and they might be too powerful.

Something tells me you uploaded the wrong file :-"

That`s the temp save file :-*

[Templar Mikeel]

Dag nabit. Lets try this.