Huron Blackheart and his Red Corsairs

[Zeb[edee]]

Hey^^ (w00p starting threads is awkward)
A few months ago, well about 6, I finally decided to start a 40K army and not to give up on it this time round. So far i had bought a Tyranid Hive Tyrant and the gaunt box set before deciding i would never get round to painting Tyranids. Then i bought a Leman Rus (Currently in the hands of thebarnet as a "meat"shield for his beloved Baneblade) and decided once more that the army wasn't for me. Then i decided to go Tau with a friend, but then one fateful afternoon. I found the latest White Dwarf posted through my door and on the front cover, Chaos Space Marines. The ruinous powers had called upon my services and I gave myself willingly. Inside the first model i saw was Huron Blackheart and I was instantly converted to the Red Corsairs.

Since then i have purchased the codex, Huron himself and the £50 Chaos Space Marine army boxset. I love them =D. Huron is painted and i have been told it is one of my best models. Now I am painting the rest of the army inbetween LOTR Grey Company. However, soon it will be finished and it will be time to expand to a decent force. I need help from some old hands at 40K, preferably Chaos, at choosing the list. The list looks something like this...

HQ:
Huron Blackheart

Elite:
5 Posessed

Troops:
10 Chaos Space Marines
-Idol of Chaos Glory
-Meltagun
-Heavy Bolter
-Aspiring Champion with plasma pistol and Powersword
-All other models equipped with a bolter

5 Chaos Space Marines
-CCW and Bolt pistols on all

10 Khorne Berkzerkers
-Skull Champion with Power Fist (Take out tanks etc) and Plasma Pistol
-All else with CCW and bolt pistol

Fast Attack

Heavy Support

____________
That is the list, I was planning on a unit of Chaos Bikers as i have seen how awesome they are, plus it fits in with the Hit and Run tactics of the Red Corsairs. I was also looking to avoid Tanks at all costs (I gave away the rhino in exchange for the opportunity to raid his BitzBox when i feel the need) Apart from a Baneblade (<3)

Obliterators were also on the checklist and a unit of Terminators to act as Hurons bodyguard. The next item was a unit of Noise Marines as they have rather nice rules in the new book.

However, all of this I would happily change. This is my first proper army in 40K so i am just seeking any and all help that can be given.
Pity the poor Nooby =P*

(By pitying me you sign over your soul and all worldly posessions. This is a perfectly legal transaction under the act of GIMME subsection B4, paraphrase 7. Thank you )

[thebarnet]

very nice zeb whent i finseh my IG or SM i will give you a game

[kenshin620]

Hmmm, nice army so far, how many trermies are you thinking? Because for $130 you can get 15 temies and a termie lord! what a deal GW cooked up!

[word bearers 81007]

since you are avoiding any tanks i would encourage a squad of havocs for anti-tank purposes. and maybe a specilized chosen squad would be cool. 5 plasma, or melta would be cool. other wise you seem to be on the right track.

[Dragoon King]

Originally Posted by kenshin620

Hmmm, nice army so far, how many trermies are you thinking? Because for $130 you can get 15 temies and a termie lord! what a deal GW cooked up!

That's not a bad ideal, if ya want a large force of Corsairs. Give ya another HQ too. I suggest Raptors and Bikes for FA, I prefer Raptors. Have a look at some I'm building (I don't like the metal ones, too big) My Black Legion works-in-progress Your avoiding tanks? Interesting. PM me if ya need any more help.

[Zeb[edee]]

As to the Terminator thing, I was initially going for a 5 man squad with a Pair of Lightning Claws, Chain Fist, Then Power Weapons all around with a liberal helping of Reaper Autocannons and combi-meltas =D

I was thinking of adding a pysker into the army but i am undecided as to whether i get a Demon Prince of Tzeentch or go a bit in theme and get my original plan which was a Space Wolf Rune Priest and convert him to a Chaos Sorcerer. This is to represent those men onboard the Wolf of Fenris who turned traitor and joined the Red Corsairs.

Also i hope to get some pictures up soon. As soon as i find my mothers Digital Camera

Also the havocs were something i had looked at but was a bit unsure about. But since someone is recommending them i will definitely think about them a bit more seriously.

[hairyyahoo]

this is all well and good but where are the PICS?!?!?!?!?

[Dragoon King]

Originally Posted by Zeb[edee]

As to the Terminator thing, I was initially going for a 5 man squad with a Pair of Lightning Claws, Chain Fist, Then Power Weapons all around with a liberal helping of Reaper Autocannons and combi-meltas =D

I was thinking of adding a pysker into the army but i am undecided as to whether i get a Demon Prince of Tzeentch or go a bit in theme and get my original plan which was a Space Wolf Rune Priest and convert him to a Chaos Sorcerer. This is to represent those men onboard the Wolf of Fenris who turned traitor and joined the Red Corsairs.

Also i hope to get some pictures up soon. As soon as i find my mothers Digital Camera

Also the havocs were something i had looked at but was a bit unsure about. But since someone is recommending them i will definitely think about them a bit more seriously.

For CC termies I would suggest a Land Raider (which would not take a Heavy Support slot, hehehe) but I know you wanna steer clear of tanks. Go with the Sorcerer, DP are a bit overrated imho. Chosen would be a nice choice too, one of the most versatile Chaos units. Oblits are also a very nice choice.

[Drax]

Originally Posted by hairyyahoo

this is all well and good but where are the PICS?!?!?!?!?

Erm... aren't you incognito because people are demanding your pics hairy? seems a bit like double standards.

Originally Posted by Zeb[edee]

HQ:
Huron Blackheart

Elite:
5 Posessed

Troops:
10 Chaos Space Marines
-Idol of Chaos Glory
-Meltagun
-Heavy Bolter
-Aspiring Champion with plasma pistol and Powersword
-All other models equipped with a bolter

5 Chaos Space Marines
-CCW and Bolt pistols on all

10 Khorne Berkzerkers
-Skull Champion with Power Fist (Take out tanks etc) and Plasma Pistol
-All else with CCW and bolt pistol

Fast Attack

Heavy Support

a good start, but if you are not taking mech support/transport there are a few things to consider. your first CSM squad is very static - you either stay put to use the heavy bolter, or you move and so don't get to use the heavy bolter. bit of a waste either way. change it for an assault weapon.

your second squad is too small to make it in to combat on foot and still be in any shape to be worthwhile. make it bigger - 8-10 strong should do it. same for the possessed

don't waste your bezerkers on tanks - they kill infantry best, let them do that.

the havoc squads would be a good addition if there are no tanks - it all depends on the role you want them to perform. for anti tank i would suggest one of the following: 6 strong - 3x lascannon/missile launcher or 8 strong - 4x meltas (give you a couple more wounds to get accross the table with)

i'm preferring bikes to raptors at the moment, but either way 8-10 raptors in a squad, or 6 bikes.

the terminators as bodyguard may work against you - if huron joins them he will invoke mixed armour which means that some shots will get distributed to him. i have never found a problem with placing an HQ in a regular 8-10 strong CSM squad. you want huron in combat anyway so regardless of his choice of squad, he is going to be on his own there anyway.

just a few of my initial thoughts

[Captain Slow]

Hey Zeb. cool avatar btw
okay first thinsg first, im agreeing with hairy here. PICS DAMN YOU! or tho shalt be beaten with a very large imperial primer when i see you next! or possibly a very large sword. whatever i happen to have at hand. ^_^

Right threats and pics demands aside, you look as if youve read the fluff on huron and seen the truely awesome model, and decided "thats the army for me" so all in all. good choice.
as for the models you currently have, it looks as you've used the models in the £50 ste well, tho, i would have assembled those 5 marines with CCW as with bolters, as at the end of the day, CSM do have a bolt pistol and CCW on top of thier bolter. dirty i know, but it does pay to maticulusly read your dex in 40K trust me on that.
as for your expansions.
Termies: All your eggs in one basket kinda thing there, but then again it might work for you. but at the end of the day, the aim of the game in 40K is for your units to make up thier points cost and keep going. so, if you buy 200pts of termies, will they kill 200pts of enemy models?
Obliterators: i see no problems there unless your plannign a fluffy army.
as for the lack of vehicles you were talking about. if your thinking of going for a Red corsairs hit and run style army, maybe you need to re think that idea, and the bikes. good idea, maybe some raptors would help you out as well. but at the end of the day the choice is yours.

now, if you are planning to do a fluffy Red Corsairs army, it might be worth your while to go here and read this: [link]http://redelf.h1.ru/w40k/ia/w40k_ia_badabwar.html[/link] its an article on the Badab war, the full story as it happens, involveing all the history of the corsairs and the other chapters that rebelled, and the chapters that fought them off.

well theres my opninion, hope it helps you out
oh BTW zeb, i want to see your huron model saturday...infact...
would you be up for a quick game of 400-500pts combat patrol on saturday at GW?

(EDIT: comps crapping out, deleted the repition)

[Drax]

whilst i agree with the good captain one thing worth considering with certain units is that if a unit costs 200, even if it cannot win back 200 points in kills, can it tie up at least that many points of your opponents army, giving the rest of your army a chance to their job? if so, that may be just as useful

btw captain, looks like you repeated yourself there

[Captain Slow]

Dont Go there im having no end of problems over in my end of the pond.
the damn collage computers internet speed has dropped off the side of a cliff this past week, and since thats where i am now, you get the idea. that and the forums didnt like me posting the link to the RED ELF site, in my previous post...just dont go there, i was listening to Frontline by Pillar 15 minutes ago, and it took half an hour to load!
like i said...just...dont ...go..there...im somehow manageing to resist the urge to bash my head repeatedly againt the dman screen. ><

(the smiley window took 2 minutes to load!!!!!! :Scared: )

[Zeb[edee]]

Originally Posted by Captain Slow

as for the models you currently have, it looks as you've used the models in the £50 ste well, tho, i would have assembled those 5 marines with CCW as with bolters, as at the end of the day, CSM do have a bolt pistol and CCW on top of thier bolter. dirty i know, but it does pay to maticulusly read your dex in 40K trust me on that.

I know Dave, I noticed the bolter, bolt pistol and ccw in the codex. I put those weapons on them to show that csm have those (others have bolters, If it doesnt make sense to you dont worry cos atm it dont make sense to me either)

whilst i agree with the good captain one thing worth considering with certain units is that if a unit costs 200, even if it cannot win back 200 points in kills, can it tie up at least that many points of your opponents army, giving the rest of your army a chance to their job? if so, that may be just as useful

EDIT::
Hmm that quote has gone wrong =\ oh well. Thank you to whoever pointed out the some shots will be allocated to huron due to rank and file marines having a better save than him thing. I didn't know that before.
Finished Editing now
____________________
Now to clear up my intentions with Terminators and Huron. The thought occured to me today whilst messing about with java that it would be much easier for the terminators to survive to the other side of the board if they just deep striked in using the Icon of Chaos Glory once that squad was over there. Huron would have travelled with them and then as soon as the Terminators arrive he buggers off to join them and they wreak fiery (or not so fiery) death amongst some people. Hopefully imperial guardsmen, But either way. Because of the new rules the icon lets them deepstrike anywhere within 6 inches of it without scattering (<3) So it makes them much more effective as an entire 5 man squad as opposed to a 5 man squad reduced down to two or three once being the target of a withering hail of fire

(I didnt waste all my time when watching those apocalypse battles, i noticed that terminators tend to get shot at ALOT. Almost as much as the baneblades come to think of it...)


Finally to the issue of the pictures! As i have said, I do really want to get some pictures up as my Corsairs are a bit different to the standard paint job that GW reccomend. I hate gold on evil looking models so the trim is in boltgun and their helmets are... I wont tell you because its my favorite part of the model and gives them a really unique look to them. The pictures should be up soon and it just depends on when and where i can get hold of a Digi camera.

Thank you to people who gave me websites for fluff as the aim was to do a "In character" army. If that does rule out Obliterators, Oh well. Il make up for it with umm... Havocs and maybe a Vindicator. (over compensation ftw)

[Drax]

the armour thing was me, and your welcome - i found out the hard way, and the least i could do was spare you the same fate!

right, those terminators - remember that when deepstriking you cannot charge that turn. therefore you will still have to suffer a turn's worth of fire. furthermore, you will be closer to the enemy so a) more weapons will be in range and able to shoot at them, and b) you will be a sudden threat that the enemy will want to be rid of as soon as possible, thus making him invoke point a.

you can however fire with them, so it may be worth equipping them with the correct ranged weaponry for their intended role so that should the worst happen, they may at least have got some worthwhile shots off first!

obliterators needn't be entirely ruled out - the fluff has now made them more like uber mercenaries, and so you could go along the lines of 'such is Blackheart's notoriety that it has attracted the attentions of a band of Obliterators who have chanced the crossing from EoT to join the Corsairs in exchange for a share in the spoils'

just a thought

[Captain Slow]

Your welcome Zeb, hope the link helped you out as far as fluff goes. and if you are THAT interested in huron, hes got a few mentions in a book, i think maybe the book was even about the corsairs?? anyone know what im going on about? it had huron and the hamahdrya on the front cover? it was called into the malestorm or sumthing?? any help plz?

[Dan296]

why stay away from mech? something i would suggest: walkers!
Defilers are
1-cool models,
2-intimidating,
3-BAMFs
and dreadnoughts are sick.

keep your bezerkers away from tanks. the fist is good for emergency dread killing, and i think thats what its there for....in which case good boy
noise marines are good.....maybe you might want a sorcerer? you dont really need to worry about anti-tank too much in such low points games....

[Zeb[edee]]

Originally Posted by Dan296

why stay away from mech? something i would suggest: walkers!
Defilers are
1-cool models,
2-intimidating,
3-BAMFs
and dreadnoughts are sick.

keep your bezerkers away from tanks. the fist is good for emergency dread killing, and i think thats what its there for....in which case good boy
noise marines are good.....maybe you might want a sorcerer? you dont really need to worry about anti-tank too much in such low points games....

I guess i haven't really explained my reasons for not taking any tanks in my army (Aside from a baneblade(<3)). So here I shall elaborate and before that the power fist was only to be used for tank busting in emergencys.
Anti-Tank Reasons.
1. Frees up LOADS of points for CSM's
2. Tend to get shot at a lot
3. I don't like the models for tanks at the moment, Only forgeworld ones impress me but WAY to expensive
4. Walkers are like half tanks. Only one of them, Not as much firepower, Not as much armor. So i would either take a REAL tank. Or none at all.
5. Whilst they can be useful to run people quickly down the flank with all guns blazing. In the new rules it looks as if they shall be nerfed slightly so it may be just as effective to run across and be in combat on the second turn if the enemy moves forwards. Then i can leapfrog from combat to combat.
6. The models are a pain in the arse to put together and look awful if you mess them up. Or the paintjob
7. NECRONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(My friend plays Necrons and He is threatening to revive them)

Those are my main reasons for no tanks and although you may not agree with them. That is why i really don't want them in my army apart from a BAMF Baneblade (<3)

[Petey1016]

Noise Marines are your friend because they are can be VERY dirty.

I find an army with no tanks in is harder to defeat than a mech list, and this is just due to a few certain facts.

1.Blow up a transport and the guys inside are pinned so you can guarantee having the same target next turn.
2. Infantry dont care if you fire a lascannon at them tanks do.
3. Getting swamped by infantry isnt funny.

Havocs are bags of fun either them or chosen with melta's, Termies need to be put into the right place so be careful during deployment, I would strongly suggest a demon prince with lash as if your out of charge range you can move em closer in your movement phase that and it gives your enemy something to worry about apart from your termies.

-Petey the Highlord of the Encarmine.

P.S. i want to start a slaaneshi army soon hehe.

[Drax]

Originally Posted by Petey1016

I would strongly suggest a demon prince with lash as if your out of charge range you can move em closer in your movement phase that and it gives your enemy something to worry about apart from your termies.

i would strongly recommend he does not. with no tanks on his side of the board a DP is going to have an even bigger target on his chest than normal.

though a regular sorcerer with the smae mark and power may be worth considering. perhaps put him in Termy armour with the actual terminator squads.

as for the Noise Marines - they are good, but expensive. at least to start with, keep to the regular CSMs

[Dragoon King]

Originally Posted by Celephus Drax

i would strongly recommend he does not. with no tanks on his side of the board a DP is going to have an even bigger target on his chest than normal.

though a regular sorcerer with the smae mark and power may be worth considering. perhaps put him in Termy armour with the actual terminator squads.

as for the Noise Marines - they are good, but expensive. at least to start with, keep to the regular CSMs

I agree with Drax. A DP would not be a good ideal. I use one reguarly, but screen him with tanks (large target rule) and he still receives some punishment. An uprotected one will die quickly. Also, Necrons don't impress me. Kill certain units (Tomb Spiders, Lord with Resurrection Orb) and hit Warriors with CC units. Lascannons are effective against Monoliths, but beware them Deep Striking. Even if they do, they can't fire the same turn. Pred with Lascannons all around, man. Wraiths should be shot, alot. Nightbringer is too slow moving. Wait till he is close to other Necrons, and pump all the firepower ya have into him, and watch him explode! DO NOT let him in assault range. Hope that helps.

[Zeb[edee]]

Well I think the input from many of you has steered me even further down the path i was going to take anyway. No to Demon Prince's and w00p w00p to a Terminator Sorcered =D. And to Dragoon. You obviously haven't seen my friends god damned dice rolling.

Honestly I have never NEVER seen so many 6's with Gauss weapons. Need i say BOOM?