Codex Daemons

[SteveBerenyi]

From Bell of Lost Souls:

HQ:Special characters:

• Kugath the Plaguefather
• Fateweaver, Oracle of Tzeentch
• Skarbrand the exiled one

God-specific Greater Demons: (significantly more potent and costly than the CSM Major)

• Bloodthirster (don't even try using psychics agasint these guys)
• Keeper of Secrets (dance marine-boy dance...you'll see)
• Lord of Change (tons of shooting, can split fire)
• Great Unclean (a tough Monstrous Creature who wounds on a 2+!)

Special character Heralds:

• The Masque (Slaanesh)
• Epidemius (Nurgle)
• The Bluescribes (Tzeentch)
• Skulltaker (Khorne)

Standard god-specific heralds (four)

-You can take 2 heralds as 1 HQ choice but the army must be led by either a GD or one of the named demons.

Elites:

• Fiends of Slaanesh
• Flamers
• Beasts of Nurgle
• Fleshhounds (with a named character upgrade option)

Troops:

• Bloodletters
• Daemonettes
• Plaguebearers
• Horrors (with a named character upgrade option)
• Furies (do not fill compulsory troops slots)
• Nurglings (do not fill compulsory troop slots)

Fast attack:

• Bloodcrushers
• Seekers of Slaanesh
• Screamers

Heavy:

• Soulgrinder
• Daemon Prince (tons and tons of options)

Wargear and Gifts:

• Chariots are coming to 40k, and are upgrade options for Heralds.
• Many new psychic powers (including a hilarious Slaneesh one which is a much saner version of lash and may inspire some truly comic dreadnought conversions)
• Khorne has an ability to ignore Psychic and Force Sword damage on a 2+!
• Most of the standard daemons are our old favorites (power weapons for knorne, poison for nurgle, etc...)

[Heroka Vendile]

sounds excellent.

[Zeb[edee]]

...
Dont Tempt Me With Demons Damnit.
Its tempting as it is...

[Xerto Inavory]

It's getting harder and harder to wait for these guys

[experiment 626]

skulltaker is just plain dumb... he rends alot more as he doesn't need just a 6, plus any rending wounds he causes inflict 'Instant Death!'...
character killer plain and simple! mind, the tyranids & the daemon prince from the chaos marine codex won't care, beyond the annoying high rending rate skulltaker gets.

still, i actually prefer the fantasy daemon book... i think overall the daemons are ALOT! nastier in fantasy - especially with characters like kairos fateweaver who's arguably the most potent magiker in the entire game! (hint: he can take 14 spells!!!)

cheers!

[themandalorian]

Ech more chaos filth lol

[Dravenguild]

I'm still not very psyched for this release...

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by Dravenguild

I'm still not very psyched for this release...

trust me, you'll want the book even if just to read! again, i prefer the fantasy book, but overall, both books have some of the best background yet!
my favourite bit from the fantasy book is easily about the assault on lustria and how kairos defeats the slaan's defenses!

cheers!

[Dravenguild]

It just seems so odd, to have CSM and CDs to be "seperate" and independent essentially.

[Drax]

no more so than having Imperial Guard seperate from Space Marines.

essentially, they are a 'race' in their own right, placing them in with CSMs or Chaos Mortals for that matter means that GW could only give them half the attention.

and don't forget, you can still use them together in Apoc!

EDIT: Does anyone know how viable single god armies will be? would also like to know the same for the Fantasy counterpart

[Dravenguild]

Its not the same anymore, they were hand in hand and it should have stayed that way.

[God_Grinder]

in itself the chaos fantasy book is great, but we have to wait and see how they are gonna amend the mortals now that they are segregated, im guessing maybe like in 40k wher they will still be able to use the lesser versions in the curent book?, and if not well it seems the BoC are totaly screwed lol. as far as 40k it never made much sence to me to segregate the deamons from CSM and still doesnt.

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by God_Grinder

in itself the chaos fantasy book is great, but we have to wait and see how they are gonna amend the mortals now that they are segregated, im guessing maybe like in 40k wher they will still be able to use the lesser versions in the curent book?, and if not well it seems the BoC are totaly screwed lol. as far as 40k it never made much sence to me to segregate the deamons from CSM and still doesnt.

I don't think anyone will disagree... but its here to stay.... so I guess we have to live with it.

[Drax]

Originally Posted by God_Grinder

in itself the chaos fantasy book is great, but we have to wait and see how they are gonna amend the mortals now that they are segregated, im guessing maybe like in 40k wher they will still be able to use the lesser versions in the curent book?, and if not well it seems the BoC are totaly screwed lol. as far as 40k it never made much sence to me to segregate the deamons from CSM and still doesnt.

it could be that it follows more of the SoC way of unit selection - though for me more needs adding!

[experiment 626]

well, i know that the hellcannon will be staying around in mortal lists for sure!

IIRC, chosen are no longer a 0-1 option either...

cheers!

[Dravenguild]

one thing ^ the "hellcannon"

for mortals.

When CSM, LotD and renegades had so much more options prior to this abomination.

Abomination in what it represents, all in all I'm sure its a great dex but it screws true chaos fanatics who either don't want to play apocalypse or they don't want to have their army hacked in half. Especially word bearers who used multitudes of Daemons.

My greatest gripe about this Dex, DAEMONS can use SOULGRINDERS and DAEMON PRINCES when CHAOS SPACE MARINES have watered down GENERIC DAEMONS.

honestly can warp spawned daemons create a defiler and then unbind it? I thought they were an anathema to technology? or a Daemon prince? I thought they hated any half breeds and mortals let alone "allow" them to fight alongside them.

It is incoherent with how they want to present the codex. When mortals want Daemons they get flavorless cannon fodder, when Daemons want to use something created by mortals they get EXTRA OPTIONS!

[Dan296]

well honestly, im not too worried about it because really, the only time ill be using my world eaters is in an apocolypse game!!

and soulgrinders are different from defilers. defilers bind a daemon inside a machine so its controlled by the deamon, but is essentially still a machine. the soulgrinder is forged in the warp, and fuses the daemon and the machine, creating the soulgrinder that is not quite daemon, not quite machine, and it can exist on both planes.

[Dravenguild]

Forged in the warp? By whom?

Defilers are bound daemon engines, Soulgrinders are unbound defilers.

They are essentially the same thing, made by CSM and mortals.

[Astral Claw 126]

hehehe...the new codex is gooo!! I got my spearhead 3 days ago, and read it cover to cover in an evening

[Dan296]

Originally Posted by Dravenguild

Forged in the warp? By whom?

Defilers are bound daemon engines, Soulgrinders are unbound defilers.

They are essentially the same thing, made by CSM and mortals.

theyre forged by deamons. theyre not related to defilers at all. they didnt used to be defilers, they are created in the warp by other deamons.

it says this is the codex. the greatest of the deamons fight over the right to a soulgrinder, because it can go in and out of the warp at will, and its body will not dissipate like other daemons so they can be in the material realm for a while. they arent made by mortal hands at all. the same daemon forges that make bloodletters' hellblades and other things like that.

TL;DR : SOULGRINDERS ARE NOT DEFILERS

[LordWaffles]

Originally Posted by Dan296

theyre forged by deamons. theyre not related to defilers at all. they didnt used to be defilers, they are created in the warp by other deamons.

it says this is the codex. the greatest of the deamons fight over the right to a soulgrinder, because it can go in and out of the warp at will, and its body will not dissipate like other daemons so they can be in the material realm for a while. they arent made by mortal hands at all. the same daemon forges that make bloodletters' hellblades and other things like that.

TL;DR : SOULGRINDERS ARE NOT DEFILERS

THE SPRUE DISAGREES!

Hahah, yeah I was going to add in that, GW split these much better and cost effective daemon from the 40k CSM and gave us those crap daemons(Honestly, I haven't made/seen/heard of a competitive list to use the buggers in a long while), on the assumption that when CSM take over a world, it takes a long while to convert it to a daemon world, as such, only minor horrible things can pop out of the warp, not quite fully conceived. But when a daemon army is afoot, reality is torn asunder and from the rip come fully fledged daemons, and as long as their's enough of them hanging around, they can feed off that tear to the warp.

tl;dr TWO ARMIES MAKE MORE MONEY THAN ONE.

Although it's vastly confusing why CSM and daemons can't ally. I mean, since they slipped the last codex under the doormat and ran, you think they could have offered us them in return. Sort of like apologetic horrors of the warp.

[Petey1016]

I read the codex the other night from a friends spearhead. The 40k kinda goes a bit along these lines:

Slaanesh: High initiative, rending low toughness no shooting all combat.
Tzeentch: Shooters galore but with not that much of an exciting range to it and several abilities that make them hard.
Khorne: Dont touch with a barge pole in combat as the Bloodletters have power weapons as basic gear, no shooting though, and horrible HQ's
Nurgle: all toughness 5 at least all Feel no pain all wound on a 4+ but next to no shooting.

I am aware that there is some shooting but thats abilities from the HQ choices. Tzeentch will be really harsh if there within range. The soulgrinder is quite wrong as its 13 on front and sides but 11 on rear and a couple nasty guns.

I worked out that you could take 15 Lash equivalents in a Slaaneshi army. a Masque can do 3 a turn and its two per hq slot = 4 Masques and 12 lashes + 3 Daemon Princes with 1 lash each.

Overall the army isnt undefeatable but it has to be defeated a certain way for each unit.

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by LordWaffles

THE SPRUE DISAGREES!
Although it's vastly confusing why CSM and daemons can't ally. I mean, since they slipped the last codex under the doormat and ran, you think they could have offered us them in return. Sort of like apologetic horrors of the warp.

My solution: ask your friends if you can use the same rules as presented in

Codex: Daemonhunters and (assumedly, I don't have the codex) Codex: Witchhunters

for allies and the like.

As for tourneys... deal with it! GW's screwed us over, to bad.

I agree... I don't like the fact that these are complete and indpendent codices... but GW seems to have a trend of making complete independent codices so what can we say?