Customizing question about SM

[Cirative]

Since a Space Marine commander can choose from the armory freely, is he permitted to take dual bolt pistols? And what about two CC weapons?

I don't care how good/bad it'd be to play that way, I just want to know if it's allowed or not.

I've never seen something say it can't be done.

[wolfpack]

Actually the rules do say that you can have two one handed weapons, a one handed and a two handed weapon or a two handed weapon...so giving him four one handed weaps is outa the question... as for giving him say two bolt pistols that is acceptable...as they count as CCW anyways you would still get the bonus attacks but would lose the armor save modifyers for having a PW in HtH...likewise you could give him the two power weaps but then there is the lack of ranged attacks so it's basically up to you

[Cirative]

That's sweet.

[r4wr89]

yea wolfpack has pretty much got it covered. two pistols means two weapons in CC, since they're both 1 handed weapons, but i'm pretty sure they don't grant shots for more than one weapon.[unfortunately!] but who cares, it looks awesome...lol

:]
-ant

[Celestial Guardian]

Wouldn't that be picking the same item twice? The top of the armoury page says you can't pick the same item twice. Or does that just apply to wargear?

[Cirative]

The double pistols don't get two shots, but are considered twin-linked. I know this 'cause the Witch Hunters codex delves into the Seraphims' dual pistols.

And the limit only counts toward wargear.

[wolfpack]

You are correct you can only choose an item once per the SM dex...but then again...you can have a Bolt Pistol and a Plasma pistol...so yer good that way...or you could have say a Frostblade and a power axe if you were a SW...giving you two Power weaps... always a loop hole to exploit some where

[Cirative]

"Models with access to the Armoury may select up to two weapons of which only one can be a two-handed weapon. In addition to weapons, you can pick up to 100 points of wargear per model, though no model can pick the same item twice."

[Heroka Vendile]

there is absolutely no point in wasting points on two power weapons, as just the one makes all attacks count as being made by a power weapon.

[Lord Commander Erus]

Originally Posted by Heroka Vendile

there is absolutely no point in wasting points on two power weapons, as just the one makes all attacks count as being made by a power weapon.

Sometimes a power weapon/power fist combo can be useful though.

[Templar Mikeel]

Yes it can, if you want to choose between I1 and double S ,or normal I.

[Baron Spikey]

Right:

You can pick 2 bolt pistols if you really want to- but except in clearly defined cases (such as the Seraphim) you can only fire 1 pistol a turn, thereby rendering the other 1 no more useful than a chainsword. It might look cool but it has no game value other than as an additional CCW.

ITs only wargear where you can only have 1 of each, you can go to town on having 2 power swords (like the bolt pistols the extra sword would be useless beyond an additional ccw, tho in this case an EXPENSIVE one).

[wolfpack]

True...but it would make for one hellacious lookin model...

[Templar Mikeel]

Take Hairy's Wolf Scout as an example.

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by baronspikey

Right:

You can pick 2 bolt pistols if you really want to- but except in clearly defined cases (such as the Seraphim) you can only fire 1 pistol a turn, thereby rendering the other 1 no more useful than a chainsword. It might look cool but it has no game value other than as an additional CCW.

ITs only wargear where you can only have 1 of each, you can go to town on having 2 power swords (like the bolt pistols the extra sword would be useless beyond an additional ccw, tho in this case an EXPENSIVE one).

There is a simple way to get around this: Attach a sword to the model... call it a power weapon, BOOM! You have a BP+P. toy combo plus the 2 bolt pistol thingie... nice eh?

[Cirative]

Originally Posted by baronspikey

You can pick 2 bolt pistols if you really want to- but except in clearly defined cases (such as the Seraphim) you can only fire 1 pistol a turn, thereby rendering the other 1 no more useful than a chainsword. It might look cool but it has no game value other than as an additional CCW.

It twin-links them though, so it's a bit more useful than a pistol/chainsword combo 'cause it does everything a chainsword would plus you're able to re-roll failed hits.

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by Cirative

It twin-links them though, so it's a bit more useful than a pistol/chainsword combo 'cause it does everything a chainsword would plus you're able to re-roll failed hits.

This is assuming you can find that rule in Codex: Space Marines. While it is true to those using Codex: Witchhunters, I have not seen this rule in Codex: Space Marines... I like the idea, but just pointing that out to you...

And honestly, if that was true... why don't we see more 2 bolt pistol ICs... for only 1 point... its worth it.

[Cirative]

Originally Posted by masterofweirdness

This is assuming you can find that rule in Codex: Space Marines. While it is true to those using Codex: Witchhunters, I have not seen this rule in Codex: Space Marines... I like the idea, but just pointing that out to you...

And honestly, if that was true... why don't we see more 2 bolt pistol ICs... for only 1 point... its worth it.

Well, there's no specific rule for it. It's true for any dual ranged weapon I've seen in any of the books. In Space Marines, you have the twin-linked bolters of the bikers, the twin-linked lascannons of the Predator, and even the twin-linked Typhoon missile launcher.

The reason I think we don't see it very often is because of the advantage versus the points cost.

For a sergeant to upgrade to dual pistols, it costs 16 points (terminator honours + pistol). And he gives up the 24" range of a bolter for only 12" with the pistols.

[masterofweirdness]

Originally Posted by Cirative

Well, there's no specific rule for it. It's true for any dual ranged weapon I've seen in any of the books. In Space Marines, you have the twin-linked bolters of the bikers, the twin-linked lascannons of the Predator, and even the twin-linked Typhoon missile launcher.

The reason I think we don't see it very often is because of the advantage versus the points cost.

For a sergeant to upgrade to dual pistols, it costs 16 points (terminator honours + pistol). And he gives up the 24" range of a bolter for only 12" with the pistols.

But, if a model can select from the armory, it costs you only 1pt for twin-linking your weapon! That is a good deal for vet. sergeants (because you'll be buying other stuff... like powerswords and Powerfists) and ICs...

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Cirative

It twin-links them though, so it's a bit more useful than a pistol/chainsword combo 'cause it does everything a chainsword would plus you're able to re-roll failed hits.

This is true in most cases, but that is because you pay a set cost for both the weapons, or an additional cost to twin-link them or there is a special rule for it. There is no rule anywhere that says if a character has two of the same weapon then it gets twin linked.

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

Originally Posted by Cirative

The double pistols don't get two shots, but are considered twin-linked. I know this 'cause the Witch Hunters codex delves into the Seraphims' dual pistols.

that, however is in the witchhunter codex, not the space marine codex so marines with 2 bolt pistols DONT get twin linked

[Cirative]

Lame.

Oh well.

[experiment 626]

Originally Posted by Cirative

The double pistols don't get two shots, but are considered twin-linked. I know this 'cause the Witch Hunters codex delves into the Seraphims' dual pistols.

And the limit only counts toward wargear.

i would honestly say that's not quite true as the seraphim's 'twin-linked' pistols is a special rule unique to them... (same as true-grit really - it's a combat style the sisters have developed.)
and again, in the tyranid 'dex, it actually states that taking 2 of the same weapon symbiote twin-links them...

there's nothing in the space marine codex alluding to 'dual guns = twin-linked'. as only a monstrous creature can fire 2 weapons, giving your commander 2 bolt pistols would simply waste that 2nd weapon slot!

cheers!