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09-13-2007
| #1 (permalink) |
| First Chaplain     Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
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Blog Entries: 5 |  *sigh* Again Well, play testing of the Black Saints list I submitted a while back felt, and indeed brought on many cries of, beardy cheese. Plus, it lacked the main thing that has endeared this army to me, it's fluff and fun. Sure, I slaughtered all comers... But it was too vicious... People were playing me to beat me or prove they could survive, rather than have fun. And that's not what 40k is about for me. So, in light of that... I have made them a full BA successor chapter from the cursed founding, with DA mix. I hope the list reflects this! C&C please! Some things are in there for fluff, so comment on them anyway, and I will tell you why! Black Saints... MK II! Lord Crusader Adonis(Company Captain): 335 pts. Lightning Claws, Jump Pack, Frag/Krak/Melta, Iron Halo -Honor Guard: 180 3 Veteran Space Marines: Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak, CCW, Jump Pack 2 Veteran Space Marines: Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak, Power Weapon, Jump Pack High Prelate Antonious the Warp Slayer(counts as Chaplain Lemartes): 305 pts. Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack, Crozius Arcanum, Rosarius, Frag & Krak, Death Mask -Honor Guard: 180 3 Veteran Space Marines: Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak, CCW, Jump Pack 2 Veteran Space Marines: Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak, Power Weapon, Jump Pack Total: 640 pts. ELITES Death Company: 80 pts. D.C. Marine(10x): Frag, Krak, Bolt Pistol, CCW, Jump Pack (Fearless, Feel No Pain, Furious Charge, Black Rage {all attacks = rending}) Terminator Squad: 230 pts. Sergeant: Storm Bolter, Power Sword, Terminator(3x): Storm Bolter, Power Fist Terminaotr: Assault Cannon, Power Fist, Dreadnought: 150 Assault Cannon, Smoke Launchers, Searchlight, Missile Launcher, Twin-Linker Autcannon Veteran Assault Squad: 195 pts. 3x Veteran Assault Marines:Power Weapon, Frag & Krak, Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack 2x: Bolt Pistol, CCW, Jump Pack, Frag & Krak Total: 1265, 625 section. TROOPS Tactical Squad (2x): 235 pts. Sergeant: Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak, Power Weapon Space Marine: Plasma Gun, Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Space Marine: Plasma Cannon, Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Space Marine (7x): Bolter, Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Assault Squad(2x): 275 pts. Veteran Sergeant: Power Fist, Bolt Pistol, Frag, Krak, Jump Pack Assault Marine(9x): Bolt Pistol & CCW, Frag & Krak, Jump Pack Total: 2285, 1020 Section FAST ATTACK Land Speeder Squadron: 275 pts. Speeder(2x): Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter Speeder: Heavy Bolter, Typhoon Missile Launcher Total: 2610, 275 Selection HEAVY SUPPORT Devastator Squad: 285 pts. Veteran Sargeant: CCW, Bolt Pistol , Frag & Krak Devastator(4x): Missile Launcher, Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Devastator(5x): Bolter, Bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Baal Predator: 140 pts. Twin-Linke Assault Cannons, Smoke Launchers, Searchlight, Over-Charged Engine, Extra Armor, Heavy Bolter Sponsons, 2995 Total, 420 Selection
__________________  "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter |
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09-13-2007
| #2 (permalink) | |||||||||||||
| One of strangess   Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Turn around... (if I'm not there I'm usually in Bangladesh)
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Really though, I am shocked by how expesnive your command squads are... thats a lot of points 5 jump pack marines, even with the power weapons and all! Quote:
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The only thing I'd say is I don't prefer powerfists, and dislike plasma cannons... and don't like combine assault and heavy weapons in one squad. Could you explain your tactics on this? Quote:
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Other than the little super expenive HQs (you have, almost 20% of your points in 2 models!) this army is really quite good. I would not want to face it. Oh, and once again, whats up with the 3 weapon dread?
__________________  Proud member of the FSBGEBS: Feed Stitch Before Getting Eaten By Stitch, Protecting the 40kterra community from a ravenous Stitch. My Blog, my life, my strangeness My WRFP campaign blog! He is no fool who gives that which he cannot keep, to gain what he cannot lose - Jim Elliot Quote:
Last edited by masterofweirdness; 09-13-2007 at 02:36 AM. | |||||||||||||
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09-13-2007
| #3 (permalink) |
| First Chaplain Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
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Blog Entries: 5 | Well, here is the BA codex. http://us.games-workshop.com/games/4...loodangels.pdf And yes, I know the Honor Guard are costly. But in fluff, I have ten vets, and the 3 HQs ruling the chapter. That set up gives me the fluff (13, as I have a Libby build I'm working on), as well as the most effective units on the TT. So, I understand the risk, but it does a good balance of fluff and power on TT. The Dread should, and CAN have the TL Autocannon upgrade (for 10 pts!). However, not the assault cannon. My mistake there! The Plasma are there to represent the chapters ties to the DA, and plus this.. Once these squads are set up, they don't move. Plasma guns = 24" rapid fire, like a bolter. Set stationary, and the close and closer a squad comes in, the more and more these two hitters tear them apart. I envision them as the top two corners of an upside down triangle fire base formation, with the devs forming the bottom tip. The DC are now free, actually, per unit types you take you get one free, the chappy does little to help actually! I only paid 30 pts. to bump the squad to 10, and gave them jump packs for 50 pts. They are my shock troops, command squad killers, etc.. I didn't take las in the devs for one reason. I can't find the pts., and missile launchers, while not as good at tank hunting, give versatility the list needs as they can take out big squads too. Plus, with combat squads, thats 2 squads if I want! The land speeder separation I will probably end up doing, it does make sense..
__________________ "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter |
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09-13-2007
| #4 (permalink) | |
| One of strangess Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Turn around... (if I'm not there I'm usually in Bangladesh)
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| Hmm... fair enough. I figured that a veteran player like you would have a decent reason for the super expesnive HQs, still, avoid powerfists (and all formers of S8+ weapons) like a plague. As for everything else, I get it. And honestly, if you can find the points, get those lascannons, even one will probably help, if only a little.
__________________ Proud member of the FSBGEBS: Feed Stitch Before Getting Eaten By Stitch, Protecting the 40kterra community from a ravenous Stitch. My Blog, my life, my strangeness My WRFP campaign blog! He is no fool who gives that which he cannot keep, to gain what he cannot lose - Jim Elliot Quote:
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09-13-2007
| #5 (permalink) | |
| First Chaplain Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 6,369
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__________________ "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter | |
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09-13-2007
| #6 (permalink) | ||
| One of strangess Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Turn around... (if I'm not there I'm usually in Bangladesh)
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__________________ Proud member of the FSBGEBS: Feed Stitch Before Getting Eaten By Stitch, Protecting the 40kterra community from a ravenous Stitch. My Blog, my life, my strangeness My WRFP campaign blog! He is no fool who gives that which he cannot keep, to gain what he cannot lose - Jim Elliot Quote:
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09-13-2007
| #7 (permalink) | ||
| the age of reptiles   Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Pelossus Alida
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i don't know if that helped, but good luck erus ! -ant
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09-13-2007
| #8 (permalink) |
| Extremis Diabolus  Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: in the shadows.
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| r4wr89, send me an e-mail at rosenadel@gmail.com and I'll send you the codex. Also, lots of stuff like the Searchlights, Smoke, etc. come standard. Every model has a Bolt Pistol, whether they want it or not! They also all have Frag and Krak Grenades. I agree with you though: the Veteran Assault Squads are just not worth it, in my opinion. If you drop the Melta-Bombs, you can take out the Veteran Assault Squad and grab another Termie squad! The HQ slots do seem to have a lot of points going to them, but that's ok. The jump packs are essential, as are grabbing more DC with the Honour Guard! By splitting up the Land Speeders, you can also have all three be A/C-HB because they're al their own squadrons. If you can find the extra 25 points to do that.
__________________   Lord of Fluff and Blood Angels Herald of Nurgle "I wield my power with the Emperor's Authority. Those who would say that I am 'radical' merely have minds too small and impotent to realize all the weapons at their disposal. Do not question my methods on account of these so-called 'Puritans'." -Inquisitor Mathias Rosenadel |
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09-13-2007
| #9 (permalink) |
| First Chaplain Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
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Blog Entries: 5 | Ok.. So it is decided I shoul drop the veteran assault squad. I'd like to use 25 pts. out of the 195 to add a third assault cannon hb type land speeder when I split the speeder squads. That leaves 170, of which I HAVE to take something that gives me free DC (can't afford the pts.), and I guess some added anti tank would help. Suggestions? EDIT: The choices I can choose from (to keep the DC numbers up) are as follows: Honor Guard, Terminator Squad, Veteran Assault Squad, Assault Squad, Tactical Squad, Devastator Squad Edit(2): I coudl also drop the power fists down to power weapons, and drop the meltas to afford the third ass can for the speeder.
__________________ "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter Last edited by Lord Commander Erus; 09-13-2007 at 12:33 PM. |
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09-13-2007
| #10 (permalink) |
| Soldaten   Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Downers Grove IL
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| hhmmm I would personally drop the Deadnought and work in points for another tact squad. I maybe bias but I dont care much for dreads when compared to 10 marines. Also you only have 1 fast attack choice so you may want to break up the squad into two. |
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09-13-2007
| #11 (permalink) |
| Extremis Diabolus Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: in the shadows.
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| I assume you mean just in the tactical squads to eliminate the power fists. I think that would be ok, especially as they have some plasma stuf to deal with big nasties before they get into CC. And if they don't kill them before that, the assault squads can help. I think there's enough other armour for the Dread to be reasonably effective. Though taking it out is definitely an option. With the 170 you have left, you could go for a minimal Tac squad and a meltagun. Though I think the best choice for anti-tank would be to get a predator and then get the TL-Lascannon turret, and the sponsons (that's 165). Or, you could get a squad of Attack Bikes with 3 bikes with Multi-meltas for 150 points. Perhaps another 15 could be scrounged to get another Jump Pack equipped DC?
__________________ Lord of Fluff and Blood Angels Herald of Nurgle "I wield my power with the Emperor's Authority. Those who would say that I am 'radical' merely have minds too small and impotent to realize all the weapons at their disposal. Do not question my methods on account of these so-called 'Puritans'." -Inquisitor Mathias Rosenadel |
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09-13-2007
| #12 (permalink) | |
| First Chaplain Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 6,369
Rep Power: 6 Thanks: 170
Thanked 331 Times in 218 Posts
Blog Entries: 5 | Quote:
__________________ "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter | |
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09-13-2007
| #13 (permalink) | |
| Extremis Diabolus Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: in the shadows.
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170+150 (from the dread) = 320 - 165 for Pred Annihilator = 155. Tact squad 115+10 (melta) +40 (Rhino) = 165. Hm. You'll have to find 10 points. I think you'd have to drop a Fist to a PW.
__________________ Lord of Fluff and Blood Angels Herald of Nurgle "I wield my power with the Emperor's Authority. Those who would say that I am 'radical' merely have minds too small and impotent to realize all the weapons at their disposal. Do not question my methods on account of these so-called 'Puritans'." -Inquisitor Mathias Rosenadel | |
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09-13-2007
| #14 (permalink) | |
| First Chaplain Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 6,369
Rep Power: 6 Thanks: 170
Thanked 331 Times in 218 Posts
Blog Entries: 5 | Quote:
__________________ "Truth is infinite. It is defined by our perception of the facts; therefore we can never know absolute truth, we can only guess at it. A man who knows he has done no wrong needs no redemption, regardless of the views of others. The truth is what he believes it to be. A man who knows he has done wrong can only be redeemed when he chooses to forgive himself." -Lord Inquisitor Balkoth Black Saints Adeptus Astartes Chapter | |
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