The role of transports in a shooting army?

[Brother_Ambrose]

Hey guys, just wanted to ask your advice on Transports for a shooting army. thoughts? Should I give each one of my tacticals a rhino to carry them?

[Ikarus]

Well the role of transports is to transport any given unit faster to a set position to setup a firebase. With that being said, I would not exactly give all your tacticals a rhino, unless you want to hold a fluff heavy mech rhino sm army. Those that move in transports will go to the position to get the right firelanes, while the normal troops move or stay stationary and let down fire support.

Ofcourse this decision all depends on who you are playing against, and also what your army list will contain.

Ikarus

[Torquemada Coteaz]

yes you would definitely not take one for all your tacticals, unneccesary points sink.
Plus if your shooting, take a razorback

[Brother_Ambrose]

i was also thinking it might be a points sink...drop pods? lol or just good deployment?

[Brother_Ambrose]

I only currently have 1 rhino (might make it a vindicator ) but had planned to buy at least 2 more...

[Torquemada Coteaz]

hmm... I wouldn't suggest including more than 1 rhino-stats transport in an army.
but taht's just my opinion.

however, since your marines are shooty. I think you might like drop pod armies as i do.
every unit in a drop pod, and only field: HQ, termies, tac squads, dreads.
basically land, fear of the darkness, unload bolter death.
by end of this half your opponents army is pretty much toast.
if you go drop pod:
always take heavy flamers on your dreads.
never take assault troops or heavy weapons. mass bolter = good

[Perturabo]

When I had a marine army I used to have a few rhinos and a few razor backs (about three of each), this meant if I really wanted to transport all six trops choices I could (somthing I think I did once) but I normaly used a razor back cause I got a nice mobile heavy weapon (twinlinked to boot) to follow my squad round!

[Levin]

Personally, transports are the best option for shooty squads... Sometimes. As far as assaulty troops go, transports are kind of a risk. Shooty squads always get to shoot out of transports while assaulty squads just have to stand around after exiting most of them.

Using a transport enables you to get into rapid fire range on turn 1 in most cases, and that's never a bad thing. However, like the other posters have said, I wouldn't put a transport on every squad.

[Plisken]

For me, Transports a a Small put purposefull part of my army, Although they may seem to be a can full-a kills, when used correctly transports can be a very effective part of the game. They not only help your troops Get to the ememy (weater its trukks for boyz or rhinos for marines). The best bet is to have 3 types of troops, The first being Recon and infintration units like scouts, the second should be the normall parts like tacticle marines, They move up like infintry and set up a basic line, Then the support units, like mounted units, whenever a unit needs some extra help, send a rhino space marines of tough to kill, and even harder if theres alot of them, also the space marines weapons are very effective in a tight battle because of there bolters rapid fire, So if your enemy has a line send some rhinos up there and rapid fire there arse IT does alot more then you think. The only problem is that they hold 10 of your beautiful marines and when the vehicle gets annahilated then there they go, this is the dowside to transports, the space marines haveGood BS, Good Toughness And a good save. And to see them die in a rhino can be hard to cope with But, seeing your mariens get to that objective 1 turn before the enemy does, Or When it gets 10-20 marines up to there lines and kills 20-30 men, it will pay itself back, but i wont always do this so use them wisely.

To sum it up rhinos can give you a massive advantage in combat and yet they can also kill alot of your men, so use them wisely.

Hope i could help.^^

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

everyone knows about mechanised tau, for instance, though rapid firing with them may be good, though is very risky - anything thatsurives the barrage of fire (and 24 str 5 shots really is a good barrage of fire!) can and probaby will assault the next turn, making it very risky. change the pulse rifles to carbines and its a completely different story - vey effective, especially if combined with marker drones - upping the firewarriors bs to 4 makes so much difference, but i digress

I often use rhinos in my marine/chaos armies, usually in conjunction with cleanse and purify and havoc squads (both with special weapons) respectively. 8 rapid firing plasma guns, or, if youre feeling less suicidal 4 meltaguns cant be bad. that, alongside the rest of the rapid firing bolters can be quite effective. choose different special weapons depending on your foe (4 flamers against termagants, even orks are great!) of course sisters get an ever better bargain, with the choice of heavy flamers

though transports (dedicated or otherwise) are good to have especially when youre playing random missions, becuase you never know when you have to go racing across the table. just keep them behind as much cover as possible! i personally prefer jet/jump troops for this role, though to each his own i suppose

and you just cant beat 2 crusaders with assault terminators lead by chaplains for a great overkill charge!

[Mecha]

in every shooty army other than DE that i do,

a transports only function is a decoy.

send a few of them in one direction, taking pot shots with them, while your other forces move into good cover.

[Brother_Ambrose]

I decided to use one rhino, with 10 bolter marines inside, as bait for a trap. When they come for this squad, they'll walk into my main firelane (hopefully) lol I'll let you guys know how it works.

[Brother_Ambrose]

Hey Mecha, love your "Captured Slaves" count. I'm going to start counting my members of the Fallen.

[Levin]

The trick is doing both good shooting and deverting enemy fire towards the transport. A lot of players toss all their 'good' troops in transports and thus, creates a subconscious instinct in opposing players to always shoot at the models in transports first. However, if you start putting crappy run of the mill troops in transports, your opponent might fire at them out of impulse, fearing your secret plan... As for me, I always take throw away, "one punch" squads in my transports. Even if they're the most expensive unit in my army, I only plan on 1 good round of shooting or assault out of my transported units. This is due to the fact that they move up unaccompanied by the rest of the army. Sometimes I get lucky and they survive longe enough to take a second shot, or assault again, but this rarely happens. Case in point, I like to put 6 woman celestians in an immolator and roll out with 2 melta guns, or a heavy flamer and a flamer. 6 T3 models is hardly enough to withstand the entire force of any opponent, but it's usually good enough to cripple one of his key squads that he built his entire battle plan around. Figure out what he really wants to hurt you with and rush it. Pop out and blow it away with the most powerful midrange/rapidfire shooting you've got. This makes the unit a priority on his list. While he's charging or shooting at them, you've got a full turn to move up and get into firing positions to take out his overzealous advance. Be careful not to get too close or you'll get consolidated into... that sucks.

[Brother_Ambrose]

My marines in the rhino are working nicely right now...rapid firing kroot first turn is cool! lol

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

nice stuff... dead xenos!

im trying to refine my own version of this tactic, though i want to try and make it a more central theme of the army

[Plisken]

Originally Posted by DeAd_cOmMaNdO

nice stuff... dead xenos!

im trying to refine my own version of this tactic, though i want to try and make it a more central theme of the army

Cool, I want to read it is it close to being done?

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

well i have an army done though you could say its just a prototype with only a few of the elements id like in the finfished army. the core is two full man tactical squads with true grit, counter charge and 2 plasma guns each, mounted in rhinos. theres also a land raider crusader, 10-man command squad led by a chaplain; 2 5-man assault squads and a venerable dread.

the current army is a mix of what id like to have in a much larger version. as i get more models and try it out a bit more ill split the army in two - one detachment with rhinos and shooty tactical squads, another with the crusader and other assault elements

[Plisken]

Sounds good. HAve you played any test games with it yet?

[newpaintbrush]

Originally Posted by Brother_Ambrose

Hey guys, just wanted to ask your advice on Transports for a shooting army. thoughts? Should I give each one of my tacticals a rhino to carry them?

God. Sloppy question.

When you ask about "transports for a shooting army", that is different from asking if you are asking about "Should I take Rhinos for some or all of my tactical squads", which is in turn different from even asking "Should I take Rhinos to TRANSPORT some or all of my tactical squads".

Do you understand the difference? No? Well I suppose I will explain, because at LEAST you used decent grammar and spelling in your post. And at least you mentioned something about the context of your army. If you had written "Transports, are they worth it?" . . . gah.

OKAY!

1. If you take Rhinos, that is one thing. Razorbacks, another, Land Raiders, yet another. Land Raider Crusaders, still another. All perform very specific roles to complement your army.

2. That means that you NEVER TAKE TRANSPORTS FOR YOUR ARMY, do you understand? NEVER. You take units that can be used to transport other units. But you should NEVER think of a transport as just "transport".

3. What does that mean? You can use a Razorback for fire support, obviously. But you can also use it to block LOS, or to obscure a vehicle behind it. You can use it to tank shock to break up an enemy assault. There are all sorts of stupid little fun things you can do, and just saying "transports" locks you into thinking about your Razorback the wrong way.

SO, should you take Rhinos?

MAYBE! (which means nothing at all!)

because if you are running shooty Marines with tanks, you at LEAST need the Rhinos to block LOS to your Land Speeders or Predators or Vindicators or whatever. Even if you don't use the Rhinos to bus your Marines around, Rhinos are still pretty good for blocking/obscuring.

But if you're going for a mass infantry army, you won't need Rhinos at all, because you're using Assault Marines, deep striking Terminators, and infiltrating Scouts to grab objectives, while using massed infantry firepower to hunt out the enemy.

SO it depends!

And next time put in more info about your army! Because a reply can only be as helpful as the information you put into it. Imagine you walk into a restaurant, and say "I want food." What do you think, that they're gonna make every dish and set it up for you? They're gonna wait for you to order something on the menu.

[Steellegioncpt]

Originally Posted by newpaintbrush

God. Sloppy question.

When you ask about "transports for a shooting army", that is different from asking if you are asking about "Should I take Rhinos for some or all of my tactical squads", which is in turn different from even asking "Should I take Rhinos to TRANSPORT some or all of my tactical squads".

Do you understand the difference? No? Well I suppose I will explain, because at LEAST you used decent grammar and spelling in your post. And at least you mentioned something about the context of your army. If you had written "Transports, are they worth it?" . . . gah.

OKAY!

1. If you take Rhinos, that is one thing. Razorbacks, another, Land Raiders, yet another. Land Raider Crusaders, still another. All perform very specific roles to complement your army.

2. That means that you NEVER TAKE TRANSPORTS FOR YOUR ARMY, do you understand? NEVER. You take units that can be used to transport other units. But you should NEVER think of a transport as just "transport".

3. What does that mean? You can use a Razorback for fire support, obviously. But you can also use it to block LOS, or to obscure a vehicle behind it. You can use it to tank shock to break up an enemy assault. There are all sorts of stupid little fun things you can do, and just saying "transports" locks you into thinking about your Razorback the wrong way.

SO, should you take Rhinos?

MAYBE! (which means nothing at all!)

because if you are running shooty Marines with tanks, you at LEAST need the Rhinos to block LOS to your Land Speeders or Predators or Vindicators or whatever. Even if you don't use the Rhinos to bus your Marines around, Rhinos are still pretty good for blocking/obscuring.

But if you're going for a mass infantry army, you won't need Rhinos at all, because you're using Assault Marines, deep striking Terminators, and infiltrating Scouts to grab objectives, while using massed infantry firepower to hunt out the enemy.

SO it depends!

And next time put in more info about your army! Because a reply can only be as helpful as the information you put into it. Imagine you walk into a restaurant, and say "I want food." What do you think, that they're gonna make every dish and set it up for you? They're gonna wait for you to order something on the menu.

Not really true. You dont want to think of transports as just LOS blockers cause then you are simply just buying terrain. Though Im sure some people didnt pick up on the fact that this is a shooty army, so I could only think that you take that "Shooting Power" and run them up in transports.

This:
A) gets weapons within range faster (more importantly meltaguns, or double tapping plasma gun)
B) gets a better advantage point (so that you can move around people using Rhinos to block your LOS)
C) Taking objectives too, the problem most shooty armies have is that they are "dug in" too much into cover and arent mobile at all, so it makes sense to have at least a few transports, cause you dont want to loose too many points to transports i.e. LAndraiders or even Ravorbacks

Further more, If you go into a Resturant and say "I want Food" then they will make a whole bunch of dishes. This is Great because it lets you get a sample of everyone's opinion and view points in different situations. I mean this isnt a food place, but rather a safe haven for ideas and thoughts, but SOME (cough cough) think that they can control it with egotistical views and insults..... We are here to have fun and shares tons, but we also cant get off track which is why Im ending this conversation, but hopfully I dont have to end this great thread.

All salute the Grammar Nazi, for he is watching above my post (literally) Hail und Sieg (consider this a warning)

[Icharus]

I played spacmarines with a shooty aspect in one list. Using 2 squads of 5 in rhinos and one squad of 5 in a landraider they all got a 2 plasma guns (trait) and used the firing slots to kill heaps of enemy soldiers while staying inside the rhino/landraider which could also shoot.

My squads were protected and could kill, in capture objective missions, transports block line of sight and tank shock so enemy falls back from objective or can't kill enough people in squad to disallow its ability to hold objectives. (I hate it when I can't find the right word)

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

you cant shoot from inside a land raider - you have to disembak since it has no fire points.

[hairyyahoo]

to me the role that my transports take in a game depends on the transport in question.

if, for example, i'm using my chaos army the rhino's role is to get my units into firing positions and then act as mobile cover or for tank shocking, or extract the squad if things go pete tong. if i'm on the defensive then its mostly mobile cover

if i'm using imperial guard chimeras however then the transport takes o a different role. because of all the firing positions in a chim it sometimes pays to keep the squad inside for most of the game as they will be unaffected by small arms fire. they can then be moved 6"a turn and fire a s**t load of shots while staying relativly safe or gun the engines for a turn if they need a bit more speed. basically, i use them like a mobile bunker.

for me, it really depends on what the army as a whole, and the particulay transports in it, can do on the table.

[DeAd_cOmMaNdO]

back in the early days of 3rd edition a friend of mine used to play with a near-mechanised IG army, with about 6 chimeras, which he used to use as towers (alongside two leman russes) in a castle formation - with the guardsmen froming the walls, the vehicles the towers, and the combat elements (rough riders, and ogryns) behind in the courtyard. deployed in a refused flank, the army was actually quite good.

[hairyyahoo]

Originally Posted by DeAd_cOmMaNdO

back in the early days of 3rd edition a friend of mine used to play with a near-mechanised IG army, with about 6 chimeras, which he used to use as towers (alongside two leman russes) in a castle formation - with the guardsmen froming the walls, the vehicles the towers, and the combat elements (rough riders, and ogryns) behind in the courtyard. deployed in a refused flank, the army was actually quite good.

that sonds interesting, might have to swipe the idea and use it myself. wonder if it will as effective in 4th ed?