Necrons: Redux

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

That's "redo" for the non-Frenchy-type people. I'm not either, but I occassionally break out the accent, or language when I am either being silly or trying to sound sophisticated.

Anyway,
Necrons need to be re-thought out. The 25% Phase Out Rule is, like my accent, silly, and the "We'll Be Back" rule is too complicated.
So, here are my ideas for the next Necron Codex.

Special Rules:
Necron: Necrons are living-metal creations of sadistic Star-Gods called the C'tan. They were once beings, albeit damaged and short-live due to their gene-altering sun's rays. Now they are emotionless, and "live" only to serve their dark masters. Models with the "Necron" special rule have the following abilities:
-"Feel No Pain"
-Instead of taking morale checks, a squad with this ability must roll equal to or under the number of models left in the squad (a 2 always passes) on 2D6. If this test is passed, then the squad fights normally. If not, the squad is pinned for the rest of the turn.

Gauss Weapons: Infer the "Rending" and "Gets Hot!" spacial rules.

All I attempted for stats was a warrior:
Necron Warrior
Pts. WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
12 3 4 3 4 1 2 1 10 4+
Weapons: Gauss Flayer
Special Rules: Necron

I think they should be more of a slow, shooty force, but still tough as nails in a fight. I also think they should be more numerous, like the classic throng of evil skeletons. I know they're all supoosed to be little Arnold Schwarzeneggers that can take almost infinite damage and still kick ass, but that was against humans. I think a Space Marine could decimate the Terminator in about two seconds. So, they have less WS, S, and armour save.

Sound like a good start?

[Ikarus]

hmm I am not too sure what to say, while you did put some good advantages and disadvantages, not too sure what to say hah. Rending, Feel no pain, but suck more in close combat, and less saves. Gets hot. Cheaper points though. Hm. Does sound like a good start, but maybe the more tough version is what I'm use to =p

[Torquemada Coteaz]

Wow... nice.
I like that idea of weaker-shambling-horde type.
Just what undead-ish should be.
*I sense a mindless plotless action shwarz vs unending horde type movie coming up*

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

Wow... nice.
I like that idea of weaker-shambling-horde type.
Just what undead-ish should be.
*I sense a mindless plotless action shwarz vs unending horde type movie coming up*

I that's what Necrons should be. The side of their codex says "Their number is Legion. Their name is Death." So, by keeping the big, good guns, they can still mow down scores of troops, but will still be weaker-skeleton-type troops in the midst of combat.

Ikarus:
I realize they are weak, but this is only the basic warriors. They are still just as tough, which I thought was important, but models like Immortals would be stronger.


In addition to all this, I think Necrons should take the Books of Chaos approach: your army must belong to one of the C'tan.

If the Nightbringer was chosen, there would be lots of Necron models, and Tomb Spyders, Monoliths, maybe some new Machine Golem, or something, etc. He is more focused on death and destruction, and feeding off of souls.

If the Deciever was chosen, you would have access to Pariahs, as well as traitors, "soul mutants", and other people-harvesting stuff. He is more about collecting souls to enslave and turn into his new vision: Pariahs.

Pariahs are supposed to be the next step in the C'tan master plan. Soul Mutants are supposed to be half-pariahs on their way to being fully transformed. My idea for them was to allow one mutation that gives one of the Pariah rules to the squad:
-Brain-Altered: Fearless
-Assimilated: Soulless
-Null: Psychic Abomination

Now, I didn't leave any options for the Dragon or the Outcast because the Dragon already has his following, and we know next to nothing about the Outcast, and given his entrapment, it is likely he has no army.

So... imporvement? Or is this further and unnecessarily compilating things?

[Torquemada Coteaz]

Actually this sounds great. I like the variation in unit thats sort of Craftworld/GodofChaos style.

this will be an awesome "codex: Armies of the C'tan" instead of "codex necrons" or "codex necrons redux"
sort of like an addon codex similar to craftworld eldar (or as far as i know of it because i haven't actually read the craftworlds codex)?

wow a lot of rending =/ ...watch out terminators and stuff
and er. is there already a machine golem? cause it'd be cool to try concepts for what the golem and soul mutants and stuff look like...

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

Actually this sounds great. I like the variation in unit thats sort of Craftworld/GodofChaos style.

this will be an awesome "codex: Armies of the C'tan" instead of "codex necrons" or "codex necrons redux"
sort of like an addon codex similar to craftworld eldar (or as far as i know of it because i haven't actually read the craftworlds codex)?

wow a lot of rending =/ ...watch out terminators and stuff
and er. is there already a machine golem? cause it'd be cool to try concepts for what the golem and soul mutants and stuff look like...

Actually, I believe the different craftoworlds will be included in the New Codex: Eldar! Along with Harlequins! So I would hope if GW did this, it would be all in one codex. There would be choices that overlapped for both gods, but they would have the aforementioned specialities.

I would also propose that the C'tan be removed as models with statlines. If you have a statline, that means you are took weak to be considered a god because you can be killed (I don't like the whole "they just leave their shells and find a new one". that's poppycock for "we wanted to make 300+ point models"). Does the Emperor have a statline? No. Did Horus have a statline? No. Do any of the Chaos or Eldar gods have statlines? No. Therefore, if GW is going to keep calling C'tan "gods", then GW had better start making them act like it. Plus, unless you're playing umpteen thousand points, they actually hamper the effectiveness of a Necron army because you have less Necrons and a quicker Phase Out! They would also have no place in a new shambling horde-type army.

Instead, there would be two new choices for HQ: Necron Overlord and Pariah Overlord, obviously based on which C'tan is chosen.

I don't know of any Machine Golem out there. I agree it would be cool to model this stuff. I think of Machine Golems as mini-Titans, akin to Battlemechs in Mechwarrior. Just a bit bigger than dreadnoughts.

[Torquemada Coteaz]

well i partially agree on the gods issue.
I see GW's reasoning behind it too. They're gods avatars, and like Daemonhosts limiting daemon's powers (in a way) the c'tan avatars limit theirs. essentially they're like "Avatar of Khaine" for nightbringer or deciever.
I'm not too clear on the "overlapping" units but basically what i meant was: non-god-following generic stats
nightbringer's lackies with special units and stats added on
deciever's lackies with special units and stats added on
however in review i do realise that they sort of have to follow a c'tan because that's the c'tan they bargained their souls with etc etc.
Erm... maybe the generic stats would be un-assimilated necrons from the other "devoured" c'tans?

Machine Golem sounds cool >: D

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Sorry, I should have worded that better. By overlapping, I meant units that both gods would have access to, such as warriors, and scarabs, and tomb spyders and such.

But Avatars are mere pieces, fractions of the power of the god they are supposed to embody. It just seems like GW went through some quirky explanation to explain what happens when you defeat them in the game (they leave their necrodermis). Basically, I think they are a points sink, and silly. It would be fun to make up a Marine Commander that was 300 points and had so many abilities it would put entire chapters to shame, but that's ridiculous, both fluff-wise and game-wise.

I think it also stems from a lack of Necron special characters. I think a Supreme Overlord, or something would be sufficient. Or instead, none at all. Necrons are not very individualistic, so player would have to just deal with no special characters. Unfair? Maybe, but no one forces you to choose an army.

[Torquemada Coteaz]

Well, truth be told I liked how the DoW did the "nightbringer", sort of.
The idea of getting your god to grant you a tiny fraction of his power and transform into an avatar of that god is nice. better than necrodermis that is. what kind of metal limits gods anyway right?
I think a couple of kinds of lords (as par the c'tan they follow, these are greater lords that act in the c'tan's stead) and a generic "commander" one (small division leaders)would suffice for necron characters (as purely a central director, so that the necrons don't go about doing their own thing), any more would be like giving them personalities and such, which as you said they obviously lack. Then again the lack of lords can be justified by a more powerful version of "hive mind" projected by the c'tan since they ARE ageess-star-gods.

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

Well, truth be told I liked how the DoW did the "nightbringer", sort of.
The idea of getting your god to grant you a tiny fraction of his power and transform into an avatar of that god is nice. better than necrodermis that is. what kind of metal limits gods anyway right?
I think a couple of kinds of lords (as par the c'tan they follow, these are greater lords that act in the c'tan's stead) and a generic "commander" one (small division leaders)would suffice for necron characters (as purely a central director, so that the necrons don't go about doing their own thing), any more would be like giving them personalities and such, which as you said they obviously lack. Then again the lack of lords can be justified by a more powerful version of "hive mind" projected by the c'tan since they ARE ageess-star-gods.

Hm. I would go along with the DoW version. I have seen the previews (I still don't have game...), and I would go along with a Necron Lord gaining the power of the god for a while, or the rest of the game or something. It's like being the daemonvessel for Chaos. That would be quite acceptable for me.

[Torquemada Coteaz]

sounds fair. would leave a lot of hassel with "OMG your nerfing the c'tan to nothingness!"
speaking of necrons dev. here's what i envisioned (one of thm anyways, that made it onto paper) for the Machine Golem:
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/1962/dsc00465zw0.jpg

Edit: the one on the left is the first one, followed by little sketches.
the one on the right is the last one i did.

I tried making it more bulky (see the little doodles) and it didn't work out well. looked like a necron termie/fatman. I think better if i make the one on the right SLIGHTLY squatter, and the face smaller/lower to seem a bit more hunched/bulky... oh and the shoulder gun isn't done on the right side one either d'oh

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

sounds fair. would leave a lot of hassel with "OMG your nerfing the c'tan to nothingness!"
speaking of necrons dev. here's what i envisioned (one of thm anyways, that made it onto paper) for the Machine Golem:
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/1962/dsc00465zw0.jpg

Edit: the one on the left is the first one, followed by little sketches.
the one on the right is the last one i did.

I tried making it more bulky (see the little doodles) and it didn't work out well. looked like a necron termie/fatman. I think better if i make the one on the right SLIGHTLY squatter, and the face smaller/lower to seem a bit more hunched/bulky... oh and the shoulder gun isn't done on the right side one either d'oh

Those both look fantastic! It is a bit on the Wraithlord side, but that's ok! It's a wonderful beginning! And middle... very close to end...

[Torquemada Coteaz]

hehe thank you.
my artistic skills are ok for doodle-wise... but generally passable art-wise.
Hope maybe we can later get some real artists and make a full fledged pdf codex for this.

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Wow, real artists... are you sure you aren't one, Coteaz?

I also think that the HQ units should be able to choose a retinue thing instead of merely joining a unit of Immortals or Pariahs. I think a sort of elite close-combat-type Necron unit is in order, classically (and perhaps cliche-ly) named "Tomb Guard".

[Torquemada Coteaz]

but the equipment and stats loadout?
sorta have to make them different from other units. (of course the lord CAN still join pariahs and immortals right?)

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

but the equipment and stats loadout?
sorta have to make them different from other units. (of course the lord CAN still join pariahs and immortals right?)

Oh, yeah, definitely. Just like an SM commander could join a veteran squad, or assault squad if he wanted to.

I think they would be something like this:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 5 6 1 4 1 10 3+

2-5 Tomb Guard per squad.
Weapons: Gauss Pike, Lightning Arc
Options: maybe a disruption field, or something.

Gauss Pike: power weapon, +D3 attacks if there are 4 or more enemy models in combat with the model wielding the Gauss Pike. Rending in close combat with vehicles.

Lightning Arc: as per Codex: Necrons

I made the squad size small because they would be kinda expaensive, and they are pretty powerful. Thoughts?

[Torquemada Coteaz]

small is good. I think the orks already nailed down
We don't want this to be the ONLY unit in the army now eh? (too many and you get 2 lords with like 20 guys each in 1500-2000 pts games and people will eschrew the rest of the force org chart... thats not nice)

Gauss pike is +D3 per weapon? or just +D3 total? (Since you roll all the same type attacks at same time, you just add D3 more to hit die?)

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

small is good. I think the orks already nailed down
We don't want this to be the ONLY unit in the army now eh? (too many and you get 2 lords with like 20 guys each in 1500-2000 pts games and people will eschrew the rest of the force org chart... thats not nice)

Gauss pike is +D3 per weapon? or just +D3 total? (Since you roll all the same type attacks at same time, you just add D3 more to hit die?)

It's like the Nurgle scythe weapon: if there are 4 of more enemy models in combat with the tomb guard model, then that model gets +D3 attacks. This applies to each model, so a unit of 5 Tomb Guard who are all in combat with 4 or more enemies may get up to 20 attack total (between all of them).

[Torquemada Coteaz]

str 5 PW attacks?
OUCH

[Inquisitor Rosenadel]

Originally Posted by Torquemada Coteaz

str 5 PW attacks?
OUCH

Yeah, that's why I limited their numbers severely... and perhaps they'd be a 0-1 unit... Put don't forget that Pariahs have the same, and they i