World Eaters Versus Space Wolves

[rintinglen]

I had Kharn the Betrayer, and 5 tooled up squads of Berzerkers (BErzerker with Mark of Khorne, furious charge, frags and Khornate Chain axes, Asp Champ with Deamon Strength, Talisman of Burning Blood, Power Fist, Furious Charge, Plasma Pistol). He had Ragnar with a wolf lord escort in a Razorback, another Lord in Terminator armour and four Terminators (2 assault cannons, Storm bolters, lightning claws), two squads of grey hunters with bolters, a meltagun, and a couple of power fists, and two squads of Blood Claws.
The mission was cleanse, omega level, and there were a scattering of rubble piles and shattered buildings, but no where near enough for a cities of death kind of scenario.

I placed first so I put a squad in the ruined chapel in the center of the building to force him back. I clustered the rest of my squads around first and put Ole Kharn in there amongst them. He deployed in and around a ruined building, withhis blood claws out in front, his Grey Wolves in the building, and his terminators along the flank.
Turn one, my blood crazed loonies rush out of cover into his line of sight. 4 of my six units had blood rage, of course Kharn being so much faster than the rest ran out infront of the rest. His Grey Hunters, Terminators and those few blood claws that could do so promplty shot one squad out of existence. His Razorback shot Kharn and took a wound off him, thanks to his bold advance far out in front of the rest of the army. The blood claws had advanced, and they charged Kharn and the next nearest unit to them.
Turn two, I was screwed over by my blood rage rules. My northern most squad, who could have charged the terminators, got blood rage and charged towards his blood claws instead. (they were marginally closer).All my squads piled in. One squad of Blood Claws was promptly whittled away to nothing, but the other proceeded to wound Kharn and tie combat with him. I then proceeded to lose the game. My only hope for survival was for my units to get tucked in with the survivng blood claws. I promptly rolled a two and two ones for consolidation when all I needed was 3 inches.
He took advantage of my difficulty and promptly blasted another squad out of existence (rending assault cannons killed seven 'Berzerkers). I retaliated by killing off his Blood Claws, but not before they did for Kharn. ( He has to be the most useless special characer in the game. Nine hits with a power weapon over two turns and he killed one Blood Claw!!!). I consolidated towards him and once again her virtually anhilated a squad. I charged his Gray hunters and killed nine for the loss of four more berserkers, but neither squad broke. He countercharged with his Terminators and then it was a big mess. I wiped out his grey hunters, but then, my last two figures were left standing in the open, where his Terminators, who had been at the other end of the conga line, promptly shot them down. I was wiped out, he had four terminators left, including a wounded lord, Ragnar and his retinue and their transport. I lost by over 600 victory points.
I have only once won a game with worldeaters; without the Rhino Rush, they stink (but I love the Red and Gold).

[masterofweirdness]

Funny, you love your army that never wins... perhaps you should try an army with attached Khorne Bersherkers? They are awsome units, but mabye two expensive for an entire army of them.

ya! now I have more posts than hairyyahoo

[rintinglen]

I have played them on occasion as part of an undivided army, but fundamentally, they are broken in fourth edition. 4th edition is all about shooting, World Eaters are all about charging and chopping. They aren't fast enough to get across the board without getting shot apart. If I play undivided then I use Raptors, a bunch of small squads built around heavy weapons, and an Obliterator squad. Then sometimes, I may livelong enough get a charge in, but the basic Berzerker is simply too expensive pointwise. He spends three turns getting accross the board, loses half or more of his squadmates, and then maybe kills a squad that costs half what his did. He gets one or at most two turns of attacks in. For the Same points you can put a 10 man Havoc Squad Armed with Lascannons and Missile Launchers on the table, and they can be shooting for the whole game if terrain allows it.
Unless there is a Land Raider, a big Terminator Squad, a Tooled up command Squad in a Marine Equivalent army, or perhaps a Monolith on the table, it is very Hard to assault something that is worth the cost of thesquad. And even if there is, all a smart player has to do is dangle a cheap bait squad (or vehicle) out there and the Berzerkers are off and running. Playing a standard mission is almost a joke if it involves taking objectives. Berzerkers are like Nurglings, they won't stay put and so cannot be trusted hold an objective.
Fortunately, Khorne cares not whose blood flows, only that it does flow.

[masterofweirdness]

I'd disagree that 4th ed is ALL about shooting... but since it has LOTS of shooting, I'd see your point.

Yep, they sound pretty... broken isn't the right word... in need of a update. (then again, CSM Codex is SO cheesy that it needs an update, but not before ORKS!)

[rintinglen]

Actually, broken is exactly the word for it.
Pure assault armies, unless they are really fast, die swiftly in 4th edition. Tyranids can get away with it because they can fleet (most of the little ones, any way), and the individual model is so cheap point wise that you can have a boat load on the table. My 8 model Khorne Squad is about 250 points. That is 25 Hormagaunts, or 14 Genestealers with scything claws. That is a 25 Man Platoon in my Guard Army.
That 25 man platoon can take the lunch money from either the nids or the Berzerkers, unless you are playing in city-fight-type terrain, or perhaps jungle terrain.
The armies that win today tend to be shooty eldar, tau, or Iron Warriors CSM.
World Eaters, Space Wolves, and other silmilar armies tend to not make the cut.

[hairyyahoo]

world eaters are a tough army to win with as alot of the time you have no control over their movement. this really buggers you up in an assult army because you will be wanting to advance through cover most of the time but end up sitting out in the open catching a face full of shells. instead of the ever popular furious charge, try giving them move through cover as a veteran skill and set them up in an area of the board with denser terrain. this will help to cut down on the incomming shots and allow more of your troops to reach combat. a character with daemonic speed is also a good buy as he can charge up to 24" in a single turn and tie up a unit so it can't shoot the rest of your army, and maybe use the combat to block line of sight for some of the rest of his force too.

masterofweirdness; we'll see about that

[masterofweirdness]

Now I see your point... Rhinos? I mean, assault marine armies can work, you just need to know when and what to assault. And 'nids are vicous! Its scary when your oppenent charges you on turn 1!

Still, I don't like to say armies are "broken" though perhaps, in some cases, it is the only word that can be used.